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Engel
March 20th, 2011, 06:15 PM
Just to tell the name of your favorite, and second favorite wheels for outdoors. lets see wich wheels gets the most votes :biggrin:

Nellie
March 20th, 2011, 10:37 PM
These:
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b51/toddtwist/AAA/Vanguard/70mmpinkvanguard.jpg
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VANGUARD-Boomerang-70mm-Roller-Derby-Skate-Wheels-PNK-/370369552402?pt=UK_Sporting_Goods_Skateboarding_Skating_ET&hash=item563bbee012 (mine aren't pink, though, and they won't get many votes here, because hardly anyone knows them)
If you don't want to spend too much, these
http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b51/toddtwist/AAA/Kryptonics/DSC01300.jpg
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/KRYPTONICS-TRUE-Downhill-Skateboard-Wheels-65mm-78a-/220528928325?pt=UK_Sporting_Goods_Skateboarding_Skating_ET&hash=item33588c6645 are amazing too (you'd need two sets, obviously, if you bought the ones in this link). My boyfriend has them and I tried them out the other day - really comfy on rough ground and easily go over pebbles ... They're a bit wide (40mm), but that didn't bother me.
I was also much faster than with the 62mm Kryptonics Routes I've been using recently.
While 62mm wheels are okay outdoors, I'd recommend larger wheels for comfort and speed.

Live2sk888
March 20th, 2011, 10:42 PM
1. Labeda Bad Boyz (oh what I would give for another set......)
2. Sure Grip Sugars

Bosco
March 20th, 2011, 10:47 PM
super mundo!!

quadskater71
March 21st, 2011, 09:07 AM
Number one has to be...

70mm Velocity race/ Twisters,

http://i710.photobucket.com/albums/ww110/Quadskater71/VRTW.jpg


and second I agree with Nellie on the Boomerangs, they are blooody great mate!! These are 70mm but the 65mm are also really good.

http://i710.photobucket.com/albums/ww110/Quadskater71/BR.jpg

jbgerman
March 21st, 2011, 05:59 PM
For longer distances the ABEC11 Flywheels 76mm, 81A. Skateboard wheels, shaped on a lathe by Johannes.

http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/bon3.jpg

To have fun outdoors: Kryptonics Impulse 58mm, 78A. Very narrow wheels, ideally for dancing and spinning.

http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/wi1.jpg

Nellie
March 22nd, 2011, 07:32 PM
70mm Vanguard Boomerang (140g), 65mm Kryptonics True (140g), 65mm Sure-grip Motion (135g), 62mm Kryptonics Route (115g)
- weight in brackets with bearings and aluminum spacers
http://i877.photobucket.com/albums/ab339/Nelli_035/Street%20Quads/outdoorwheels.jpg

I tried out my new Sure-Grip Motions today, and so far I'm not very impressed. They're so grippy or even sticky that at the beginning it was hard to do T-stops, and they make squeaky sounds on very smooth surfaces. They felt slower than the Kryptonics Trues and provided less cushioning on uneven ground.
As these wheels are highly recommended on the French forum, I hope that they will improve with use.

Stormi
March 22nd, 2011, 09:35 PM
I've only just started skating outdoors, but after doing a lot of reading, went with the Krypto Route 65's (78A). They worked well. Did an 8km trail skate on a rough track - several changes in the track surfaces from asphalt to cement to some sort of paving. Lots of cracks and debris in some parts of the track, but the kryptos handled it all well.

Gero
March 24th, 2011, 09:57 AM
1. Velocity Race 70mm/84a from Pacer
(aka RD Twister) - (both discontinued)
2. Helium 64mm/83a from Roll line
3. nothing
4. nothing
5. Route 70 70mm/78a from Kryptonics (just for dirty and uneven streets)

Engel
April 2nd, 2011, 06:25 AM
2. Sure Grip Sugars

I've heard wonders about the sugars from a friend of mine, she is so in love with hers she is almost getting married to those things.

Engel
April 2nd, 2011, 08:08 AM
sorry for the stuopid question, but:
Are those boomerang wheels discontinued? if they are (wich i figured they probably are by the link posted) are they hard to come by? because i have lots of stuff to pay for right now, but i am reading some threads here in the outdoor session and they look like really good wheels from the few that mention them, they seem to love them. so i just wanted to know if i should jump at the opportunity of buying a set as soon as i can find it, or if they arent really rare

jbgerman
April 3rd, 2011, 03:25 PM
sorry for the stuopid question, but:
Are those boomerang wheels discontinued? if they are (wich i figured they probably are by the link posted) are they hard to come by? because i have lots of stuff to pay for right now, but i am reading some threads here in the outdoor session and they look like really good wheels from the few that mention them, they seem to love them. so i just wanted to know if i should jump at the opportunity of buying a set as soon as i can find it, or if they arent really rare

They were discontinued in the late 80s. So if you have a good opportunity to buy them for a reasonable price, - and you want them - you should jump at the chance.

Armadillo
April 3rd, 2011, 05:22 PM
We can't really take all the reviews of outdoor (indoor too) wheels too seriously.
Why? -- Because they are always based on comparisons with what other wheels a skater has skated. If the reviewer has never previously skated on any truly outstanding set of outdoor wheels, then what is their reference point for assessing the performance of a new set for them? When someone tells me how good a set of wheels rolls outdoors, I want to know what is the BEST previous set of wheels they rolled were. If those are actually not so hot wheels, then they might just be too easily impressed with the new ones and overly enthusiastic for them.

Most of us veteran outdoor skaters here at SLF consider the discontinued 70mm Velocity Race wheels to be our reference wheel for what is the best performing outdoor quad wheel. Sadly, not every outdoor quad skating enthusiast has had or will have a chance to skate on these.
However, my point is that unless you have experienced the really high performance truly primo wheels can give you, it is too easy to be impressed with not so good wheels, merely because they are better then the majority of crappy wheels that have the "outdoor" or "indoor/outdoor" marketing label slapped on them and have a duro reading that is on the 78A-89A range.

Yes, it is good to know how people rate the mediocre and less than stellar wheels too, since at least we can still purchase (or avoid) these, but it is also helpful to state your previous best wheel experience for skating outdoors, to better qualify the opinion(s) you might offer.

-Armadillo

jbgerman
April 3rd, 2011, 05:44 PM
We can't really take all the reviews of outdoor (indoor too) wheels too seriously.
Why? -- Because they are always based on comparisons with what other wheels a skater has skated. [...] 70mm Velocity Race wheels to be our reference wheel for what is the best performing outdoor quad wheel. Sadly, not every outdoor quad skating enthusiast has had or will have a chance to skate on these.
-Armadillo

The Velocity Race might be the ultimate reference, but they are gone. It is nearly impossible to find a set, used or NOS. So we should take a more realistic scenario as a reference.

Or we must threatening a manufacturer with the use of armed force to offer a reasonable outdoor wheel - e.g. 70 mm diameter, 35 mm wiede, 80A-85A, large core, etc.

sommemi
April 5th, 2011, 01:55 PM
I've only just started skating outdoors, but after doing a lot of reading, went with the Krypto Route 65's (78A). They worked well. Did an 8km trail skate on a rough track - several changes in the track surfaces from asphalt to cement to some sort of paving. Lots of cracks and debris in some parts of the track, but the kryptos handled it all well.

+1 :D

I also would put Boomerangs second... but I have an OLLLLLD set of Kryptos, the harder sea-blue colored ones with "Krypto" actually imprinted in the side of the wheel, not painted on. Got them from a friend when I did the A2A and they skated just fine, but on the gator-back (the rough surfaced road) it was hell... but I don't know if ANY wheel could have made that section of road any better!!!!:wink:

gotsk8s
April 5th, 2011, 11:44 PM
I had some Variflex outdoor wheels in the early `80`s that were awesome.
Now all I have are Hyper Rollo`s, Sure Grip Aerobics and some cheapos`s off ebay that are smooth as glass.

Banzai
April 6th, 2011, 07:21 AM
Old school "Baby Kyrpto's" 57mm 78a red w/ black hubs "KYRPTOS" embedded in the wheel end x2.
Used the have a set of green that were 57mm 90a ish? IIRC.

jbgerman
April 6th, 2011, 08:28 AM
Old school "Baby Kyrpto's" 57mm 78a red w/ black hubs "KYRPTOS" embedded in the wheel end x2.
Used the have a set of green that were 57mm 90a ish? IIRC.

The green were 92A, a still own a set of this wheels. The other colors were yellow 88A and white 96A.

jbgerman
April 6th, 2011, 08:35 AM
I had some Variflex outdoor wheels in the early `80`s that were awesome.
Now all I have are Hyper Rollo`s, Sure Grip Aerobics and some cheapos`s off ebay that are smooth as glass.

These Variflex wheels?

http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/vari.jpg

65 mm diameter, ca. 85A.

gotsk8s
April 6th, 2011, 11:33 AM
These Variflex wheels?

http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/vari.jpg

65 mm diameter, ca. 85A.
Yep, that be the ones :wink: Loved them things

jbgerman
April 6th, 2011, 03:46 PM
Yep, that be the ones :wink: Loved them things

Yur're right they are awesome. I didn't used them for a while, because the space between the bearings is 10 mm. This doesn't fit at my current plates. But a Sure-Grip Classic NTS plate and long speed axles are waiting here for the right boots. Then I will mount the wheels again.

gotsk8s
April 6th, 2011, 04:01 PM
Yur're right they are awesome. I didn't used them for a while, because the space between the bearings is 10 mm. This doesn't fit at my current plates. But a Sure-Grip Classic NTS plate and long speed axles are waiting here for the right boots. Then I will mount the wheels again.

I think at the time I was skating mine I was using Satellites and the axles were plenty long enough on those. Also the hubs in my Variflex were black. If you would, be on the lookout for me set over there would ya? :D

jbgerman
April 6th, 2011, 05:53 PM
I think at the time I was skating mine I was using Satellites and the axles were plenty long enough on those. Also the hubs in my Variflex were black. If you would, be on the lookout for me set over there would ya? :D

I will, promised.

The Satellites are speed plates? Am I right? I'm skating artistic plates, which have more narrow axles. But the "Classic" will be equipped with longer, all threaded speed axles.

gotsk8s
April 6th, 2011, 06:16 PM
I will, promised.

The Satellites are speed plates? Am I right? I'm skating artistic plates, which have more narrow axles. But the "Classic" will be equipped with longer, all threaded speed axles.

Yeah, the Satellites are speed plates. Wondering, just outta curiosity if it would be possible to mill down the front side of the bearing spacer in the hub enough to be able to use regular length artistic axles instead of dropping the extra $ to accommodate for these wheels? Just curious, thats all. I`d prolly do like you and set up for these wheels because after this, all wheels will fit then :wink: lol

oh, and thanks too :wink:

jbgerman
April 6th, 2011, 06:40 PM
Yeah, the Satellites are speed plates. Wondering, just outta curiosity if it would be possible to mill down the front side of the bearing spacer in the hub enough to be able to use regular length artistic axles instead of dropping the extra $ to accommodate for these wheels? Just curious, thats all. I`d prolly do like you and set up for these wheels because after this, all wheels will fit then :wink: lol

oh, and thanks too :wink:

The speed axles are already here. I can't use them, because they don't fit at my both pairs of Skates with Snyder plates. And my BOEN has flip axles. I'm looking for boots for the Classic plate, which I want to use outdoors and with the speed axles I'm able to mount e.g. the Variflex wheels, or the SIMS Gyro, which I want to skate once again.

gotsk8s
April 6th, 2011, 06:43 PM
Dude, you got Gyros too? You need to quit already lol. Boots seem like the least of your worries then. I all but envy you because of wheels. I`m not supposed to and I don`t but I do lol.

jbgerman
April 6th, 2011, 07:10 PM
Dude, you got Gyros too? You need to quit already lol. Boots seem like the least of your worries then. I all but envy you because of wheels. I`m not supposed to and I don`t but I do lol.

http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/sims.jpg

In Germany it isn't easy to get nice skate boots.

gotsk8s
April 6th, 2011, 07:14 PM
http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/sims.jpg

In Germany it isn't easy to get nice skate boots.
Right now I don`t like you lol. I`m only kidding. But man you got some seriously smooth outdoor wheels dude. Gyros and Variflex? C`mon :tongue:

jbgerman
April 6th, 2011, 07:21 PM
Right now I don`t like you lol. I`m only kidding. But man you got some seriously smooth outdoor wheels dude. Gyros and Variflex? C`mon :tongue:

I have some more... e.g. 70mm Kryptonics

http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/wheel6.jpg

gotsk8s
April 6th, 2011, 07:24 PM
i have some more... E.g. 70mm kryptonics

http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/wheel6.jpg
quit already!!!!

jbgerman
April 6th, 2011, 08:03 PM
quit already!!!!

Some more outdoors wheels, welcome?

Rollerbones 60 mm, 80A
http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/wheel1.jpg

Suregrip "Kryptos like"
http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/wheel11.jpg

KR Street Roller - 85A - old but not very impressive
http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/wheel25.jpg

Kryptos Rentals - excellent for roller dancing.
http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/wheel31.jpg

Clasique Hardcore - 88A for smooth surfaces.
http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/wheel51.jpg

gotsk8s
April 6th, 2011, 08:10 PM
Some more outdoors wheels, welcome?

Rollerbones 60 mm, 80A
http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/wheel1.jpg

Suregrip "Kryptos like"
http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/wheel11.jpg

KR Street Roller - 85A - old but not very impressive
http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/wheel25.jpg

Kryptos Rentals - excellent for roller dancing.
http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/wheel31.jpg

Clasique Hardcore - 88A for smooth surfaces.
http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/wheel51.jpg
I`ll let ya keep these if you give me the Variflex`s :D ;) :tongue: :redface: :rolleyes: :(

jbgerman
April 6th, 2011, 08:25 PM
I`ll let ya keep these if you give me the Variflex`s :D ;) :tongue: :redface: :rolleyes: :(

:) Old-School rules :D

gotsk8s
April 6th, 2011, 08:27 PM
Yes it do!

Armadillo
April 7th, 2011, 10:07 PM
Forget old school - THESE RULE!
Or rather RULED for the last few years -- too bad production was discontinued.

http://i489.photobucket.com/albums/rr259/RRLedford/Wheels/velocity_rage_70x35mm_92a_small.jpg

-Armadillo

jbgerman
April 8th, 2011, 06:51 AM
Forget old school - THESE RULE!
Or rather RULED for the last few years -- too bad production was discontinued.

http://i489.photobucket.com/albums/rr259/RRLedford/Wheels/velocity_rage_70x35mm_92a_small.jpg

-Armadillo

Too bad, yes.


But the choice of wheels depends on your purpose, also outdoors. There can be much more activities than to gain speed and distances.

Armadillo
April 8th, 2011, 07:28 AM
Too bad, yes.


But the choice of wheels depends on your purpose, also outdoors. There can be much more activities than to gain speed and distances.

Quite true, and in that regard the Old School stuff did offer way more options for better handling of the various types of outdoor skating styles and surfaces.

-Armadillo

Goldnblazer
April 8th, 2011, 06:34 PM
I am going to be really sad when my Velocities bite the dust.

fireman1293
April 10th, 2011, 03:16 AM
I have two sets of 70mm Krptos for sale $75 for the new set and $50 for the used set.
http://https://picasaweb.google.com/104769002645728790158/Craiglist?authkey=Gv1sRgCPjKlPnKpuPxrAE#5535334560643798066

Altazero
April 10th, 2011, 07:48 AM
Right now I don`t like you lol. I`m only kidding. But man you got some seriously smooth outdoor wheels dude. Gyros and Variflex? C`mon :tongue:

Back in the day my white Gyros were among my best outdoor racing wheels. As I recall the Variflex wheels came in Yellow (78A) and Green (84A?) - both of my sets had the black hubs though. We did mill down the inner bearing seat so they would fit on Boens :-)

Cool wheels - you NEVER see these on eBay or anywhere else!

loony888
April 10th, 2011, 08:05 AM
i have a set of cruciani road wheels, 60mm x 46mm.

would these be any good? pretty sure they're to hard for skates though.

paul

cass38a
April 10th, 2011, 08:42 AM
i have a set of cruciani road wheels, 60mm x 46mm.

would these be any good? pretty sure they're to hard for skates though.

paul

One of the best wheels around, they come in a few types and hardness. Plenty of races have been one on CG's

loony888
April 10th, 2011, 10:31 AM
One of the best wheels around, they come in a few types and hardness. Plenty of races have been one on CG's


hmmm, i look a little silly there!
my link didn't work! i had a link to some 90a bones, they were the ones i was asking if they were any good LOL.

my CG's are great road wheels! i've had them from new, they're a little discoloured now but still holding their shape well, i'm going to try them out on my new outdoor set up before deciding whether to buy a new set of road wheels or not.

paul

cojaco61
April 10th, 2011, 10:32 AM
One of the best wheels around, they come in a few types and hardness. Plenty of races have been one on CG's

Just picked myself up a set of 6 spoke Cruciani 96a. Great wheel, raced them today with excellent results

sommemi
April 26th, 2011, 02:30 PM
Finally found pics of my Kryptos...
http://www.math.kent.edu/~mtackett/misc/skates2.jpg

And my son's Route 65's... (technically, these are now his girlfriends skates)
http://www.math.kent.edu/~mtackett/skating/skates%20002.jpg

DaFreshPrince81
April 26th, 2011, 10:51 PM
I gotta set of Sims Street Snakes at the moment which i get on with really well when on various terrains, but m thinking of getting some of thse SFR SLICKS which apperently are really soft? has anyone tried em?

erksh
April 26th, 2011, 11:25 PM
Hey! I have a set of those Kryptos, but red!

They're on my mother's old tennis shoe skates.

sommemi
April 27th, 2011, 01:57 PM
Hey! I have a set of those Kryptos, but red!

They're on my mother's old tennis shoe skates.

LMAO!!!!!!! That's a riot! Because just this last weekend I put MY Kryptos on my sister's old tennis shoe skates and have been skating the driveway with them!!!! LOL :p Small world. :wink:

Let's see if I can post the pic from my facebook page...
http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/225509_10100150531705284_23312081_47739450_6583235_n.jpg

jbgerman
April 27th, 2011, 02:14 PM
Old Kryptos: 62 mm or 65 mm?

sommemi
April 27th, 2011, 02:58 PM
Old Kryptos: 62 mm or 65 mm?

Honestly I don't know... would have to look it up/search for it. I don't know off hand. It's not on the wheel itself.

Speed freak
May 3rd, 2011, 06:58 PM
Genereally in the Uk most people skate using outdoor wheels. If someone over here does use an indoor wheel it is usually a belair hockey wheels. SO the average skater over here has good knowledge of outdoor wheels. I personally own about ten different types of Kryptronics (route 70,65 62, impulse etc), A few sets of SIMS both original and re-issues. Sure-grip aerobic, Airwaves, SFR slicks, Sreet hub.

But without a doubt the best outdoor skate wheels I have owned or ever used are the RD Twister's. They are unbelievable! I even like using them indoors too. I have four sets of these wheels, which I obtained by having to by the skates that they come on :-) I could not find the wheels for sale on there own anywhere.

The only thing I dont like is the fact that they take 698 micro bearings. Because I cant find upgrades for the bearings in this size I continue to use the ABEC 5's that come with them. Even with these bearings they are still faster then all the other wheels I have mentioned even with my bones swiss ceramic bearings in them.

Banzai
May 4th, 2011, 05:58 AM
ROLLERBALLS!!!!! almost forgot about 'em

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b278/banzeye/rolerballs.png
used to have a NIKE-super x - acs 651 trucks "skatepark" set up with these bad boys in black :biggrin:

Gero
May 4th, 2011, 08:04 AM
Genereally in the Uk most people skate using outdoor wheels. If someone over here does use an indoor wheel it is usually a belair hockey wheels. SO the average skater over here has good knowledge of outdoor wheels. I personally own about ten different types of Kryptronics (route 70,65 62, impulse etc), A few sets of SIMS both original and re-issues. Sure-grip aerobic, Airwaves, SFR slicks, Sreet hub.

But without a doubt the best outdoor skate wheels I have owned or ever used are the RD Twister's. They are unbelievable! I even like using them indoors too. I have four sets of these wheels, which I obtained by having to by the skates that they come on :-) I could not find the wheels for sale on there own anywhere.

The only thing I dont like is the fact that they take 698 micro bearings. Because I cant find upgrades for the bearings in this size I continue to use the ABEC 5's that come with them. Even with these bearings they are still faster then all the other wheels I have mentioned even with my bones swiss ceramic bearings in them.

I made exactly the same experiences.
I tested about 15 to 20 different sets of outdoor wheels in the past years, mainly the most of them are on the same level. There are just two wheels which are much faster than the rest, Roll line Helium 64mm 83a and more the RD Twister aka Velocity race with 65 or 70mm 84a.

You can't buy the RD Twister as a single set of wheels, they were only available in complete roller skate sets which are discontinued since two years and now off the market. Therefore I bought 9 sets of these skates just to get these wheels in my private stock to be save in the next years for the best outdoor speed wheels ever. :-)

Its unbelivable that all the famous wheel manufacturers are no able to produce a wheel like this with at least 70-76mm diameter and around 84a durometer with such a good roll and speed for all the outdoor speed and distance skaters in the world. A kind of NoName company offers here the best material ever... really strange...

Cheers

Gero

gotsk8s
May 4th, 2011, 02:18 PM
ROLLERBALLS!!!!! almost forgot about 'em

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b278/banzeye/rolerballs.png
used to have a NIKE-super x - acs 651 trucks "skatepark" set up with these bad boys in black :biggrin:

A girl I knew at our rink back in the early 80`s had a set of these in orange. She let me try them out. I didn`t use them outside, only at the rink inside. The rink had the blue blue roll on surface and man, these wheels wouldn`t stick for nothing lol. With them being round like that only a small section of wheel surface was actually touching the floor. I wasted no time giving them back lol.

jbgerman
May 4th, 2011, 08:09 PM
ROLLERBALLS!!!!! almost forgot about 'em

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b278/banzeye/rolerballs.png
used to have a NIKE-super x - acs 651 trucks "skatepark" set up with these bad boys in black :biggrin:

Nice Gullwing trucks. I own 4 of the Rollerballs, new and unused. And I'm searching for 4 more, to complete a roller skates setup.

Gero
May 4th, 2011, 08:35 PM
Nice Gullwing trucks. I own 4 of the Rollerballs, new and unused. And I'm searching for 4 more, to complete a roller skates setup.

I had a set of 8 pcs in red in 1981, don't ask me where they are today...?
I only used them in the half pipe, no grip at all... but looked... different! :-)

Speed freak
May 30th, 2011, 12:05 PM
Number one has to be...

70mm Velocity race/ Twisters,

http://i710.photobucket.com/albums/ww110/Quadskater71/VRTW.jpg


and second I agree with Nellie on the Boomerangs, they are blooody great mate!! These are 70mm but the 65mm are also really good.

http://i710.photobucket.com/albums/ww110/Quadskater71/BR.jpg

I too think the 70mm Twisters (Velocity race) are the best that I have owned or used. I have three sets of the twisters, but I have not used the velocity race although I have heard that they are the same. Have you or anyone else noticed any difference between the Twisters and velocity race? Also how does the boomerangs compare to them?

Speed freak
May 30th, 2011, 12:11 PM
Forget old school - THESE RULE!
Or rather RULED for the last few years -- too bad production was discontinued.

http://i489.photobucket.com/albums/rr259/RRLedford/Wheels/velocity_rage_70x35mm_92a_small.jpg

-Armadillo

Indeed! Does anyone here know of any place that has 698 micro bearings that are of a higher standard then the ABEC 5 bearings that come with these wheels? Its amazing how fast these wheels are with the standard bearings in them. Imagine if Bones made a 698 Bones swiss/Ceramic micro bearing! the speed would be insane!! Also Are these wheels so fast because of the tire or because they take 698 micro bearings?

Old School Roller
May 30th, 2011, 12:22 PM
Just picked myself up a set of 6 spoke Cruciani 96a. Great wheel, raced them today with excellent results

Wasnt on Evil Bay was it with derby equipment???:o:o:o:o

cojaco61
May 30th, 2011, 12:28 PM
Wasnt on Evil Bay was it with derby equipment???:o:o:o:o

Got them from Flemo004

jbgerman
May 30th, 2011, 03:08 PM
Indeed! Does anyone here know of any place that has 698 micro bearings that are of a higher standard then the ABEC 5 bearings that come with these wheels? Its amazing how fast these wheels are with the standard bearings in them. Imagine if Bones made a 698 Bones swiss/Ceramic micro bearing! the speed would be insane!! Also Are these wheels so fast because of the tire or because they take 698 micro bearings?

Because I use 7 mm axles, I had to get "607" bearings for the Twister. Got some from SKF, one side shielded. After I have cleaned and re-lubricated them - very fast.

Elysarian
May 31st, 2011, 04:40 PM
Indeed! Does anyone here know of any place that has 698 micro bearings that are of a higher standard then the ABEC 5 bearings that come with these wheels? Its amazing how fast these wheels are with the standard bearings in them. Imagine if Bones made a 698 Bones swiss/Ceramic micro bearing! the speed would be insane!! Also Are these wheels so fast because of the tire or because they take 698 micro bearings?

Here's some with ceramic balls (http://www.vxb.com/page/bearings/PROD/Kit7746) - ABEC 7 rating but fairly expensive at $24.95 each (or close to $400 for a full set)
Or would you prefer full ceramic (http://www.vxb.com/page/bearings/PROD/Kit7759)? (I hope you're ready for the price though... $69 per bearing or a shade over $1,100 a set if I got the math right).

That was just a cursory googling though, may find better prices elsewhere (doubt you'll find them made by any of the skate bearing makers though, they tend to stick to the bigger sizes).

Speed freak
May 31st, 2011, 06:58 PM
jbgerman - Comparing just the bearings, whilst trying to leave out the other factors e.g. different plates (7mm and 8mm) and boots. Is there a major difference in speed etc between the 607 (7mm) SKF bearing and the ABEC 5 bearings that come with the twisters? I know its difficult because your 7mm plates are probably better then your 8mm and you probably dont have identical boots that they are mounted on.


Elysarian - I did come across those as well, but the price is insane! Plus I like skate bearings.

jbgerman
May 31st, 2011, 08:03 PM
[QUOTE=Speed freak;509129]jbgerman - Comparing just the bearings, whilst trying to leave out the other factors e.g. different plates (7mm and 8mm) and boots. Is there a major difference in speed etc between the 607 (7mm) SKF bearing and the ABEC 5 bearings that come with the twisters? I know its difficult because your 7mm plates are probably better then your 8mm and you probably dont have identical boots that they are mounted on.

Before I tried the Velocity Race with the original bearings and shims to reduce the diameter. The SKF have a better "roll" and less bearing clearance. - in my subjective observation.

Elysarian
May 31st, 2011, 08:17 PM
jbgerman - Comparing just the bearings, whilst trying to leave out the other factors e.g. different plates (7mm and 8mm) and boots. Is there a major difference in speed etc between the 607 (7mm) SKF bearing and the ABEC 5 bearings that come with the twisters? I know its difficult because your 7mm plates are probably better then your 8mm and you probably dont have identical boots that they are mounted on.


Elysarian - I did come across those as well, but the price is insane! Plus I like skate bearings.

I also prefer skate bearings, my "outdoor" wheels are an old set of Variflex so I can get away with more normal 608 bearings in mine.

Speed freak
June 2nd, 2011, 02:35 PM
[QUOTE=Speed freak;509129]jbgerman - Comparing just the bearings, whilst trying to leave out the other factors e.g. different plates (7mm and 8mm) and boots. Is there a major difference in speed etc between the 607 (7mm) SKF bearing and the ABEC 5 bearings that come with the twisters? I know its difficult because your 7mm plates are probably better then your 8mm and you probably dont have identical boots that they are mounted on.

Before I tried the Velocity Race with the original bearings and shims to reduce the diameter. The SKF have a better "roll" and less bearing clearance. - in my subjective observation.

where did you get your 7mm bearings from? and were they 607 or 697?

jbgerman
June 2nd, 2011, 02:50 PM
[QUOTE=jbgerman;509150]

where did you get your 7mm bearings from? and were they 607 or 697?

You need size 607. E.g. http://www.thebigbearingstore.com/servlet/the-1030/607-dsh-2RS-607-dsh-ZZ-Radial-Ball/Detail

I found the SKF at a specialized retail store for bearings and other mechanical parts in Germany.

gotsk8s
June 2nd, 2011, 08:22 PM
[QUOTE=Speed freak;509825]

You need size 607. E.g. http://www.thebigbearingstore.com/servlet/the-1030/607-dsh-2RS-607-dsh-ZZ-Radial-Ball/Detail

I found the SKF at a specialized retail store for bearings and other mechanical parts in Germany.
Now, that bearing is the same size other than the inner race diameter? Cool. Gonna definitely get some `cause these:
http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f76/lambohaha/002-5.jpg
are awesome!! with the exception of the 8mm + sleeve thingy :frown:

gotsk8s
June 2nd, 2011, 08:33 PM
[QUOTE=Speed freak;509825]

You need size 607. E.g. http://www.thebigbearingstore.com/servlet/the-1030/607-dsh-2RS-607-dsh-ZZ-Radial-Ball/Detail

I found the SKF at a specialized retail store for bearings and other mechanical parts in Germany.
Not sure about the quality of this bearing but can`t argue with the price.
http://cgi.ebay.com/20-Bearings-607-ZZ-7x19-Small-Size-Metal-Ball-Bearing-/130330941405?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e585457dd#ht_2188wt_905

Just noticed something. The 688 is 8x16x5 while the 607 is 7x19x6 so I`m not so sure the 607 will work in the hub.

jbgerman
June 2nd, 2011, 11:17 PM
[QUOTE=jbgerman;509829]
Not sure about the quality of this bearing but can`t argue with the price.
http://cgi.ebay.com/20-Bearings-607-ZZ-7x19-Small-Size-Metal-Ball-Bearing-/130330941405?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e585457dd#ht_2188wt_905

Just noticed something. The 688 is 8x16x5 while the 607 is 7x19x6 so I`m not so sure the 607 will work in the hub.

The 688 won't work in this hub, because the bearing must be 8x19x6. This is size "698". Same size with 7 mm inner diameter for 7 mm axles - 7x19x6- is size "607".

688 are micro-bearings used in some inline speed skates. 698 are "mini-bearings", also used in some inline wheels and also in the Velocity Race or RD Twister wheels.

Executive Summary:

Velocity Race or RD Twister need "mini-bearing" with 19 mm outer diameter and 6 mm width. For 8 mm axles the size is "698". For 7 mm axles the size is "607".

gotsk8s
June 2nd, 2011, 11:40 PM
[QUOTE=gotsk8s;509917]

The 688 won't work in this hub, because the bearing must be 8x19x6. This is size "698". Same size with 7 mm inner diameter for 7 mm axles - 7x19x6- is size "607".

688 are micro-bearings used in some inline speed skates. 698 are "mini-bearings", also used in some inline wheels and also in the Velocity Race or RD Twister wheels.

Executive Summary:

Velocity Race or RD Twister need "mini-bearing" with 19 mm outer diameter and 6 mm width. For 8 mm axles the size is "698". For 7 mm axles the size is "607".

Oh, so its 698`s in there. My eyes are shot. lol I thought they were 688`s. okay, cool, again lol

Speed freak
June 4th, 2011, 02:05 AM
[QUOTE=gotsk8s;509917]

The 688 won't work in this hub, because the bearing must be 8x19x6. This is size "698". Same size with 7 mm inner diameter for 7 mm axles - 7x19x6- is size "607".

688 are micro-bearings used in some inline speed skates. 698 are "mini-bearings", also used in some inline wheels and also in the Velocity Race or RD Twister wheels.

Executive Summary:

Velocity Race or RD Twister need "mini-bearing" with 19 mm outer diameter and 6 mm width. For 8 mm axles the size is "698". For 7 mm axles the size is "607".

Wouldnt that mean that the 7mm is 697. Where are you getting the '0' in the 607 from? I thought it was 7x19x6 just like 698 i.e. 8x19x6. I dont know as I do not have them, but that would make more sense to me, but i may be wrong.

gotsk8s
June 4th, 2011, 02:47 AM
Wouldnt that mean that the 7mm is 697. Where are you getting the '0' in the 607 from? I thought it was 7x19x6 just like 698 i.e. 8x19x6. I dont know as I do not have them, but that would make more sense to me, but i may be wrong.

Check the link in post #69. It is what it is.

cass38a
June 7th, 2011, 02:17 AM
:D
http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t287/cass38a/Cruciani003.jpg

gotsk8s
June 7th, 2011, 02:22 AM
NICE

cass38a
June 7th, 2011, 03:32 AM
I skated on worn a set of these about 12 months ago, they fly. These are the most expensive wheels I have ever bought and will only be used for racing. I have had them since the 9th April but havent rolled them yet, next race is on the 17th July so they need to wait a while still.

kiwimaster
June 7th, 2011, 04:08 AM
What hardness??
I have 99a in CG and some 96a
box fasters I have 99a and I think 95/96 a
My favourite wheel for the momment is a set of Box faster doubles,91a on the inside with 89a on the outside,very smooth and fast on carpark type circuits
I am on the lookout for wheels in the 92-95 range...and trying to guess what will be the go on the new Timaru track


I skated on worn a set of these about 12 months ago, they fly. These are the most expensive wheels I have ever bought and will only be used for racing. I have had them since the 9th April but havent rolled them yet, next race is on the 17th July so they need to wait a while still.

cass38a
June 7th, 2011, 04:51 AM
Not 100 percent sure (not stamped on the back) but think they are 84, they are the same wheels that Alan Fleming and Peter Edmonds have been using.

I had the option of 6 spoke 96a or these but couldnt spring the $$$ for both.

I was using a set of 84a laser lite racing wheels (same as a vanilla trackstar/scribble) and loved them until a big chunk of one wheel decided to part company with the hub. The poor things died at the exact time as my avatar pic was taken crossing the line in the 200 TT:(.

I vary between 69 - 73 kg depending on how much I have been working so the softer wheels seem to suit me.

I am planning on a January 2012 trip if work and $$ permit.

Speed freak
June 8th, 2011, 01:49 PM
cass38a and kiwimaster - have you guys used the velocity race/ Roller Derby twister? how do the wheels you are using compare?

cass38a
June 8th, 2011, 09:54 PM
I haven't skated either of these wheels. I have skated wheels of the same dimentions and my opinion is that the taller narrow 70mm wheels are faster if you are skating long distances with no real need to crossover or sprint.

So if skating a trail is your thing then get them if you can (and get me a set too:).

kiwimaster
June 8th, 2011, 10:03 PM
I havn't skated on the velocity race wheels,would like to as they seem to be the wheel of choice on the forum here.
All my wheels are at present old school Italian...wishing I had never taken that bag full of goodies to the local skateboard shop 20 years ago and given all my wheels away to the local kids......

Speed freak
June 9th, 2011, 01:21 PM
do either of you know anyone with the velocity/twisters? if so, borrow them. I would love to hear your comparisons.

Gero
June 9th, 2011, 01:41 PM
I don't think that the VR or RD Twister are available or common in Australia.

Borrow them yours, if you like to get their opinion! :tongue:

Cheers

Gero

Fresh Eddie Fresh
June 14th, 2011, 03:22 PM
I don't think that the VR or RD Twister are available or common in Australia.

Borrow them yours, if you like to get their opinion! :tongue:

Cheers

Gero

I am not sure how much shipping would be to Australia (orders over $100 are free to the US) but if you could find someone to split an order of RD Aerials with you (they come in high low setups so you need two pairs to get a set of 65mm and a set of 70mm Twisters) you could just buy two pairs for $60 a pair. You might even be able to sell the skates themselves on Craigslist and make a couple bucks back.

http://www.skates.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=U-947&click=84734

cojaco61
June 14th, 2011, 11:33 PM
I am not sure how much shipping would be to Australia (orders over $100 are free to the US) but if you could find someone to split an order of RD Aerials with you (they come in high low setups so you need two pairs to get a set of 65mm and a set of 70mm Twisters) you could just buy two pairs for $60 a pair. You might even be able to sell the skates themselves on Craigslist and make a couple bucks back.

http://www.skates.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=U-947&click=84734

Maybe I need to track these down when I am over your way in August.

cass38a
June 15th, 2011, 08:56 AM
Maybe I need to track these down when I am over your way in August.

I will go you halves if you do. We can race for who gets each size:D

Gero
June 15th, 2011, 10:01 AM
+1

The slower one of this race seems to need the 70mm RDs. :D

Fresh Eddie Fresh
June 15th, 2011, 08:12 PM
+1

The slower one of this race seems to need the 70mm RDs. :D

You can't argue that logic! :D

hamtaro
June 16th, 2011, 07:48 PM
my fav outdoor wheels are anything that doesn't rattle your teeth out while skating! as i am wheelie challanged i will even use my only pair of semi decent indoor wheels outdoors.

wondering if the new timaru surface would be good with an indoor wheel?

cojaco61
June 17th, 2011, 12:55 AM
I will go you halves if you do. We can race for who gets each size:D

What distance? :D:D:D

cass38a
June 17th, 2011, 08:05 AM
What distance? :D:D:D

10k :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

Gero
June 17th, 2011, 08:28 AM
10k :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

10K? A sprint race? No Way! :D

Come on guys, real competition starts with 100k!!! :tongue:

cojaco61
June 17th, 2011, 09:38 AM
10k :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

:D:D:D

Ohlingsrus
June 25th, 2011, 02:20 AM
I have some more... e.g. 70mm Kryptonics

http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/wheel6.jpg

I have a set of these. Krypto roadrunners, 70mm x 35mm and 78a. Great training wheel. My are worn down to about 65mm. Ran atom poisons on Wednesday on some new asphalt and they were pretty fast. They r a 62x44 but not sure of hardness, 84a I think. I have been looking at skateboard wheels to try and find a good 70mm wheel. Came across Cadillac Wheels. They are making a 70x35 in an 80a. I think I might try a set.

Nellie
June 25th, 2011, 01:50 PM
I have been looking at skateboard wheels to try and find a good 70mm wheel. Came across Cadillac Wheels. They are making a 70x35 in an 80a. I think I might try a set.
I'd be very interested to know how you like them, as I have considered those too. For now I've got enough 70mm wheels, but it would still be nice to know in case I ever run out.

Ohlingsrus
June 25th, 2011, 06:13 PM
For longer distances the ABEC11 Flywheels 76mm, 81A. Skateboard wheels, shaped on a lathe by Johannes.

http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/bon3.jpg

To have fun outdoors: Kryptonics Impulse 58mm, 78A. Very narrow wheels, ideally for dancing and spinning.

http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/wi1.jpg

Jbgerman, guttentag, was is los? I looked at those abec 11 flywheels yesterday. Look like they have a great hub. Did you trim the urethane off the back of the wheel so it is flush with the hub? And do you have any issues with hitting the wheel on the boot?

jbgerman
June 25th, 2011, 08:09 PM
Jbgerman, guttentag, was is los? I looked at those abec 11 flywheels yesterday. Look like they have a great hub. Did you trim the urethane off the back of the wheel so it is flush with the hub? And do you have any issues with hitting the wheel on the boot?

Johannes shaped them:

http://www.skatelogforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19427

The bearings sit in the middle of the wheels (centered) and the inner side has to be cut to the edge of the inner bearing.

Hitting depends on the primary on the plates, secondary on the tightness of the cushions/trucks and also on the boot. I had to change the blue SG cushions and go to slightly harder yellow at the BOEN Speed plates to avoid rubbing.

Ohlingsrus
June 29th, 2011, 03:56 AM
So I looked some more at abec 11 and they have a 72mm that is 84a. I saw it listed as a freeride and a striker. They list the contact patch as 32mm but I can not tell what the hub is like. Especially the inner side. Does anyone have any feedback on the roll line heliums? 64mm and 83a sounds pretty good. Large hub too. I'm gonna see if I can get a hold of Abec 11 tomorrow and get some more info. I read a review of the cadillacs, longboard though, that said they flat spotted and coned pretty quickly. Not sure if I will get a set now or not.

yedaki_de
June 29th, 2011, 06:22 PM
Always look onto http://www.silverfishlongboarding.com/Wheel_Reviews/Wheel_Reviews.html if you need info about longboardwheels.

The Caddilacs have no good reputation...

Johannes

Ohlingsrus
June 30th, 2011, 02:25 AM
Yeah I saw that about the cadillacs. I did find another wheel. Landyachtz zombie hawgs. They are 76mm with a 42mm core. Side set so you don't have to run them on a lathe to run them on skates. Come in 78a, 80a, 82a, 84a, and 88a. They are a bit wide, in the 40-45mm range, but you can lathe the outside off to line up with the hub. Good reviews on silverfish too. The only bad thing is they have rounded edges which I am not a fan off. I will probably get a set and post my thoughts next week. I like the size, hub size and the duros that are available plus by the time they are 70mm the rounded edges should be gone. I have not measured the width but I know the contact patch is 33mm. A little pricey too, $50-60 for 4 wheels.

Armadillo
June 30th, 2011, 06:39 AM
.... Does anyone have any feedback on the roll line heliums? 64mm and 83a sounds pretty good. Large hub too. ...

The Helium wheels are rather good for their small size, and are the lightest outdoor speed wheel. Their ratio of hub diameter to wheel diameter (49/64) is HIGHER than any other wheel, which also means their urethane layer is extremely thin.
However they are NOT DURABLE enough to be an everyday kind of wheel, unless you roll on ONLY super smooth outdoor surfaces with no sharp stones or sharp contact edges.
They weigh under 100 grams each with 627 bearings - and only 90 grams each with 688 micro bearings, 22mm delrin OD adapters, and aluminum 7mm x 8mm axle sleeve-spacers.

The combination of a 49mm hub with a 64mm OD results in a wheel that is too easily damaged from having TOO THIN a layer of urethane. Sharp stones will easily cut into the urethane, especially all around the protruding rib that sticks up beyond the rest of the hub OD.
This protruding rib locks the urethane onto the hub, but it also makes the urethane above it only about 5mm or less thick, The ring of urethane right above this rib gets CUT TO SHREDS over time at a rate 10 times faster than cuts appear elsewhere on the wheel.

I now consider my Roll-line Heliums to be ONLY for use as racing wheels, and only when the race course is very clean and smooth.

-Armadillo

Gero
June 30th, 2011, 08:29 AM
Yeah I saw that about the cadillacs. I did find another wheel. Landyachtz zombie hawgs. They are 76mm with a 42mm core. Side set so you don't have to run them on a lathe to run them on skates. Come in 78a, 80a, 82a, 84a, and 88a. They are a bit wide, in the 40-45mm range, but you can lathe the outside off to line up with the hub. Good reviews on silverfish too. The only bad thing is they have rounded edges which I am not a fan off. I will probably get a set and post my thoughts next week. I like the size, hub size and the duros that are available plus by the time they are 70mm the rounded edges should be gone. I have not measured the width but I know the contact patch is 33mm. A little pricey too, $50-60 for 4 wheels.

Check out the experiences of Johannes to the landyachtz zombies in this thread and below: http://www.skatelogforum.com/forums/showthread.php?p=463993#post463993

Actually they are mine and the have the best roll on rough roads, even better than the Velocity Race. They were cut on a lathe.

I use them just when I know that the asphalt I am skating on will be rough to very rough, for all other conditions the Velocity Race aka RD Twister is still the better, faster and lighter wheel.

I also had the chance to test the cutted ABEC 11 Flywheels in 76mm 81a, but with my weight of about 95kg they are really not the wheel deal, much slower than the VR Race and RD Twister (both 70mm and 84a) and even the Landyachtz Zombies 76mm with 84a.

Seems that I just can get happy with everything sounds like 84a. :-)

Ohlingsrus
June 30th, 2011, 07:39 PM
Check out the experiences of Johannes to the landyachtz zombies in this thread and below: http://www.skatelogforum.com/forums/showthread.php?p=463993#post463993

Actually they are mine and the have the best roll on rough roads, even better than the Velocity Race. They were cut on a lathe.

I use them just when I know that the asphalt I am skating on will be rough to very rough, for all other conditions the Velocity Race aka RD Twister is still the better, faster and lighter wheel.

I also had the chance to test the cutted ABEC 11 Flywheels in 76mm 81a, but with my weight of about 95kg they are really not the wheel deal, much slower than the VR Race and RD Twister (both 70mm and 84a) and even the Landyachtz Zombies 76mm with 84a.

Seems that I just can get happy with everything sounds like 84a. :-)

Gero, Vielen dank. I tip the scales at 90kg. I have been looking for a good all around outdoor wheel. I am liking the "hawgs" more and more. I do like the VR/twisters but do not want to have to get a set of 607 bearings. Did Johannes make the zombie hawgs narrower or smaller diameter? I was thinking of only making them narrower. I skate a NTS labeda proline for outdoors.

Thanks for info on the roll line heliums Armadillo. I put way too many miles on my skates outside to drop $90-100 on a set that will not last.

Ohlingsrus
June 30th, 2011, 07:55 PM
to mention that the Landyachtz Zombie Hawgs have an improved urethane formula or so they claim.

gotsk8s
June 30th, 2011, 08:42 PM
I do like the VR/twisters but do not want to have to get a set of 607 bearings.


Why not? especially at this price? I`m gonna get me some.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130330941405&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT
Right now I use the sleeves (I know I know) and they fit better that way than they would on an 8mm axle.

Ohlingsrus
June 30th, 2011, 11:12 PM
I skate on an inconsistent surface most of the time. I need a wheel with a bit more urethane. I may end up getting a set of Twisters but I just ordered 8 Landyachtz Zombie Hawgs, 76mm 84a and teal in color. Good hub size but I will need to trim the width a little bit on lathe.

Fresh Eddie Fresh
July 11th, 2011, 05:38 PM
I just found a set of old school Boomerangs, so I am going to see how they skate compared to my Velocity Race wheels.... they feel much softer, but I hear good things about them, so I am excited!

Gero
July 11th, 2011, 06:17 PM
I just found a set of old school Boomerangs, so I am going to see how they skate compared to my Velocity Race wheels.... they feel much softer, but I hear good things about them, so I am excited!

You can't compare a 78a wheel to a 84a wheel if you are looking for speed performance. These are two different worlds.

Speed freak
July 12th, 2011, 01:29 AM
You can't compare a 78a wheel to a 84a wheel if you are looking for speed performance. These are two different worlds.

you can if you put Bones swiss ceramics in the boomerangs :-)

Fresh Eddie Fresh
July 12th, 2011, 01:42 AM
I know it is a little apples and oranges, not only is the hardness different, but the Pacers are 70mm and the Boomerangs are 65mm. Maybe if they are really slow I will get fit faster. ;)

Armadillo
July 12th, 2011, 06:13 AM
you can if you put Bones swiss ceramics in the boomerangs :-)

You are exaggerating the amount of increase in speed that primo bearings can give you. My basic Bones Reds might be about 1% slower than ceramics.

On the other hand, great wheels can give you a 10% speed improvement.
This is around an order of magnitude more improvement than primo bearings can give compared to decent bearings.

-Armadillo

Gero
July 12th, 2011, 08:55 AM
You are exaggerating the amount of increase in speed that primo bearings can give you. My basic Bones Reds might be about 1% slower than ceramics.

On the other hand, great wheels can give you a 10% speed improvement.
This is around an order of magnitude more improvement than primo bearings can give compared to decent bearings.

-Armadillo

I agree that the differences in time will be less than 1% by using different sets of standard against "quality" bearings. The bearing is not the main thing to increase a speed setup. From my experience I don't recognize any speed improvement by using expensive or ceramic bearing instead of standard ones. This is in my eyes just marketing from the bearing industry, not something I could really measure in times by skating my tracks.

I don't agree that great wheels can give you a 10% speed improvement, when I compare 78a wheels (I know that there are also differences between them) against an 84a wheel with same diameter, the improvment in time for same tracks by using 84a will be for my weight around 30-40%.

Cheers

Gero

jbgerman
July 12th, 2011, 08:59 AM
I don't agree that great wheels can give you a 10% speed improvement, when I compare 78a wheels (I know that there are also differences between them) against an 84a wheel with same diameter, the improvment in time for same tracks by using 84a will be for my weight around 30-40%.



Strongly second this.

BackofthePack
July 12th, 2011, 09:24 AM
Hell, after all this going back and forth I'm still shaking my head over the idea that Pacer turned out anything decent enough to be sought out on the secondary market.


Anyone try the Radar Fuel's with the aluminum hubs? 66mm x 78a. I rolled them a few times and they seem to have really great roll on smooth asphalt or concrete. A little heavy on the vibration on the rough stuff though.

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.derby4all.com/images/P/fuel_pink.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.derby4all.com/Radar-Fuel.html&usg=__S7lCDN--faW9IwLC3Ifl0qP74G4=&h=1944&w=1944&sz=505&hl=en&start=0&zoom=1&tbnid=tGajCsGmR1-QlM:&tbnh=173&tbnw=173&ei=GAYcTtKDMebTiAL61ZD4CA&prev=/search%3Fq%3DRadar%2Bfuel%2Bwheels%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff%26client%3Dsafari%26sa%3DN%26rls%3Den%26biw%3D1280%26bih%3D664%26tbm%3Disch&um=1&itbs=1&iact=hc&vpx=1023&vpy=103&dur=612&hovh=204&hovw=204&tx=76&ty=79&page=1&ndsp=15&ved=1t:429,r:4,s:0

Armadillo
July 12th, 2011, 08:39 PM
I agree that the differences in time will be less than 1% by using different sets of standard against "quality" bearings. The bearing is not the main think to increase a speed setup. From my experience I don't recognize any speed improvement by using expensive or ceramic bearing instead of standard ones. This is in my eyes just marketing from the bearing industry, not something I could really measure in times by skating my tracks.

I don't agree that great wheels can give you a 10% speed improvement, when I compare 78a wheels (I know that there are also differences between them) against an 84a wheel with same diameter, the improvment in time for same tracks by using 84a will be for my weight around 30-40%.

Cheers

Gero


I was applying the 10% factor to the difference between the very best outdoor wheels compared to crappy outdoor wheels -OR- to people using indoor wheels for outdoor skating. Poor rebound formula and too-soft or too-hard wheels can absolutely slow you down by 10% or EVEN MORE, relative to super good wheels! Especially over longer distances where you get worn out by the extra effort needed to keep you rolling at speed, and when you run out of gas you might end up skating 20% slower.

You are right that a primo outdoor wheel is not going to be 10% better than a good outdoor wheel, but the FULL RANGE of wheel performance for outdoor skating is MUCH WIDER than the range of bearing performance.

-Armadillo

Armadillo
July 13th, 2011, 03:35 PM
Hell, after all this going back and forth I'm still shaking my head over the idea that Pacer turned out anything decent enough to be sought out on the secondary market.


Anyone try the Radar Fuel's with the aluminum hubs? 66mm x 78a. I rolled them a few times and they seem to have really great roll on smooth asphalt or concrete. A little heavy on the vibration on the rough stuff though.

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.derby4all.com/images/P/fuel_pink.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.derby4all.com/Radar-Fuel.html&usg=__S7lCDN--faW9IwLC3Ifl0qP74G4=&h=1944&w=1944&sz=505&hl=en&start=0&zoom=1&tbnid=tGajCsGmR1-QlM:&tbnh=173&tbnw=173&ei=GAYcTtKDMebTiAL61ZD4CA&prev=/search%3Fq%3DRadar%2Bfuel%2Bwheels%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff%26client%3Dsafari%26sa%3DN%26rls%3Den%26biw%3D1280%26bih%3D664%26tbm%3Disch&um=1&itbs=1&iact=hc&vpx=1023&vpy=103&dur=612&hovh=204&hovw=204&tx=76&ty=79&page=1&ndsp=15&ved=1t:429,r:4,s:0

I have no experience with these wheels.
If they are 78A and still not so good on rougher asphalt, then I suggest that this confirms my view that under 70mm size wheels are not effective as outdoor wheels. They may be useable, but do not expect much from them for handling rougher asphalt. They drop lower into the wider spaced pits of the rough asphalt, which turns into vertical vibrations and slows you down. Larger diameter wheels do not drop down as far into the gaps between the stones, so the ride is better & faster.
The bigger the gaps between the stones of the asphalt, the larger a wheel it takes to give you a smooth ride.

-Armadillo

Speed freak
July 14th, 2011, 09:35 AM
You are exaggerating the amount of increase in speed that primo bearings can give you. My basic Bones Reds might be about 1% slower than ceramics.

On the other hand, great wheels can give you a 10% speed improvement.
This is around an order of magnitude more improvement than primo bearings can give compared to decent bearings.

-Armadillo

When I put my Bones swiss ceramics in my Krypto route 70 outdoor wheels I do not feel there is much difference in performance between the route 70's and my roller derby twisters wheels. The main difference I noticed is weight. Also I notice a big difference between my bones reds and my bones ceramics. I am not talking about ceramic bearings in general, I mean bones ceramics. I have tried other ceramic bearings,and the bones seem to be much better then other ceramic bearings I have tried. But I agree that the choice in wheel is more important then the bearings.

Finn 427
July 17th, 2011, 05:57 AM
I have had a bit of a read of the wheels posted on here as I am looking to get to the outdoors stage shortly. I just scored a set of skates that have a set of red Krypton Project II on them. They look rather similar to the red Kryptos pictured on a few posts here. Any ideas on how these are as I am still waiting on delivery?

loony888
July 29th, 2011, 11:16 PM
well i have my nice wide CG's for netball courts and smooth fast outdoor stuff, but i just received my yellow NOS outdoor deanos and i'm dying to try them out, just waiting on some bones reds to arrive now........
i managed to find a set of boomerangs for sand's skates too, 4 green, 4 black.

paul

Ohlingsrus
October 2nd, 2011, 04:47 AM
Finally got around to putting some pictures on the internets so I can post them here. Anyway, Zombie Hawgz, skated a dozen or so times now. I have machined them down to 76mm x 34mm. Great roll and carry a lot of momentum. Definitely not a sprinting wheel cause they are heavy. With a 7.5 Bont QRC, 625 NTS Labeda proline and the Hawgz my skates weigh 1340g. Pics below of the wheels and skates.

http://i1119.photobucket.com/albums/k634/Shankeesnoodle/Skates/100_0584.jpg

http://i1119.photobucket.com/albums/k634/Shankeesnoodle/Skates/100_0583.jpg

I really like the wheels for longer skates, even fast outdoor skates with average speeds in the high teens/low twenties. I don't get any wheel bite unless I cross over in a sharp corner.

1888bc
July 31st, 2012, 09:19 PM
measure out to 72mm x 36mm x 78a

http://www.skatelogforum.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=529&pictureid=4734

Formerly Fast
July 1st, 2013, 11:59 AM
I had some Variflex outdoor wheels in the early `80`s that were awesome.
Now all I have are Hyper Rollo`s, Sure Grip Aerobics and some cheapos`s off ebay that are smooth as glass.

Had the same wheels back in the 80's to, best wheels I ever used indoors and outdoors. Would love another set

gregor.b
July 2nd, 2013, 08:44 PM
These Variflex wheels?

http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/vari.jpg

65 mm diameter, ca. 85A.

I remember I had a set of these in yellow and a set in green. Also, the La Beda Bad Boyz. Then of course, the Hyper Strada of varying colours. And Dims, I think they were called. Still got heaps of them.

Faves were the bad boys followed by the Dims.

CARTchamp
July 6th, 2013, 04:07 AM
Tom Peterson Hyper Strada's

Armadillo
July 6th, 2013, 09:42 PM
I finally had to pull the trigger on a set of my own 76mm Zombie Hawg wheels in the 84A turquoise color since at $36 per set of four, this was just too good to pass on.

Once I have narrowed them on the lathe, they will be my primary wheels for my latest outdoor heavy duty "Metro skate - Urban Warrior" build pictured below with the failed experiment flattened inline wheel setup.

Will post before anf after machining PICs.

http://i489.photobucket.com/albums/rr259/RRLedford/AirZoom3/20130612_124920_zps933e3e12.jpg (http://s489.photobucket.com/user/RRLedford/media/AirZoom3/20130612_124920_zps933e3e12.jpg.html)


These are the "Mini Hawgs" at only 70mm:

http://i489.photobucket.com/albums/rr259/RRLedford/Wheels/MiniZombieHawgs.jpg (http://s489.photobucket.com/user/RRLedford/media/Wheels/MiniZombieHawgs.jpg.html)


-Armadillo

steadyeddie
February 20th, 2015, 10:19 PM
Bump.
Has anyone seen or tried these new wheels by Radar. They're called Flyers. 66mm 78a. OMG they look amazinghttp://radarwheels.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/Flyer-Green-Angle.jpg

Armadillo
February 21st, 2015, 03:59 AM
What is the hub diameter of these Radar wheels? weight?

If your plates can handle these, you will have a hard time finding a better performing set of outdoor wheels than the Zombie Hawg 76mm 84A orange with ~44mm hubs and narrowed to ~30mm width on the lathe.
These are now my fav outdoor wheels:
http://i489.photobucket.com/albums/rr259/RRLedford/Wheels/Z-Hawgs/OrangeSetDone_zps5171c8ee.jpg
http://i489.photobucket.com/albums/rr259/RRLedford/Wheels/Z-Hawgs/20140514_230503_zps8ea12610.jpg
http://i489.photobucket.com/albums/rr259/RRLedford/AirZoom3/20130723_163320_zps2ba3da33.jpg
http://i489.photobucket.com/albums/rr259/RRLedford/AirZoom3/20130813_110822_zps759e57f8.jpg

Nike Zoom Air BB shoes with glued on Dragonplate sole C_F laminate sole stiffeners as well as 100% glued-on Nova plate; suspension upgraded to Chicago Panther trucks with 100% threaded "7mm" Titanium axles and 100% internally threaded (9/32-32) chrome moly steel 8mm OD axle size adapter sleeves allowing for use of Acer Racing 608 SiN ball bearings ($79 per set of 16);
double barrel Nova translucent blue cushions with lower barrels undersized to ~.900" (23mm).
Near DA45 ease of sharp turning with a steeper and more stable kingpin angle.

-Armadillo

steadyeddie
February 22nd, 2015, 04:29 AM
I have no idea of the hub size or weight. They remind me of Heliums (shape), but with more urethane to bring them up to 66mm.

I've been using a combination of RD 70mm Twisters on the backs, Route 65's on the fronts. I can't fit 70's on my fronts, and the RD Twister 65mm's got chewed up quickly on some of our wonderful NYC streets.

Hey Dillo, a question. Those 76mm wheels... How is the control at high speed? Are they harder to control than smaller wheels? I had a pair of womens RD Aerial skates (where I got the twisters from), removed the composite plates and grinded them flat to mount on my next pair of high-tops. I can definitely fit 76's on them, but worry about safety.

Speaking of safety, I'm still recovering from broken ribs (2), from slipping on ice about a month ago. Boy does it suck not being able to skate!

Armadillo
February 22nd, 2015, 09:30 PM
I have no idea of the hub size or weight. They remind me of Heliums (shape), but with more urethane to bring them up to 66mm.

I've been using a combination of RD 70mm Twisters on the backs, Route 65's on the fronts. I can't fit 70's on my fronts, and the RD Twister 65mm's got chewed up quickly on some of our wonderful NYC streets.

Hey Dillo, a question. Those 76mm wheels... How is the control at high speed? Are they harder to control than smaller wheels? I had a pair of womens RD Aerial skates (where I got the twisters from), removed the composite plates and grinded them flat to mount on my next pair of high-tops. I can definitely fit 76's on them, but worry about safety.

Speaking of safety, I'm still recovering from broken ribs (2), from slipping on ice about a month ago. Boy does it suck not being able to skate!

The lathe-narrowed Z-Hawgs are very stable and easily controlled at high speeds, at least for me and all the other people I have made them for.
I suspect that the particular plate on which they are mounted dictates more about high speed control than the wheels themselves will. I advise steeper kingpin angle plates for outdoor skating.

Only negative on them I have is that, like your ice caused slip & fall, they slip laterally during the push, if there is any significant amount of water on the rolling surface.

-Armadillo

Krew76
February 23rd, 2015, 10:57 AM
Airwaves or original Sims streetsnake

Armadillo
February 24th, 2015, 08:05 AM
... I had a pair of womens RD Aerial skates (where I got the twisters from), removed the composite plates and grinded them flat to mount on my next pair of high-tops. I can definitely fit 76's on them, but worry about safety.

Speaking of safety, I'm still recovering from broken ribs (2), from slipping on ice about a month ago. Boy does it suck not being able to skate!

I have owned many of the RD Aerial skates, purchased only for their wheels, but did skate one pair long enough to know that heir suspensions are crappy and their internally threaded axle tip scheme, which relies on nylon coated bolts to hold the wheels on, is dubious at best, and a definite safety threat.

Have you ever lost a front wheel on the push foot while rolling at decent speed? Say hello to a face plant and perhaps a few more broken ribs when that happens. In my case it was only rib cage muscle tear and ligament damage, but the few sneezes I endured as things healed felt exactly like a sword going right though my body.

-Armadillo

jbgerman
February 24th, 2015, 01:40 PM
I tried several wheels, but for recreational outdoor skating I still rely on vintage Kryptonics Impulse wheels, 58 mm diameter, 78A.

http://rollerskate.blogger.de/static/antville/rollerskate/images/skkk.jpg

Most important criteria: The polyurethane has very high rebound. And I can skate with the small wheels very agile. For rougher surfaces I sometimes use the Sure-Grip Motion 62mm. In my opinion underrated outdoor wheels, with also higher rebound, than most other currently available alternatives.

steadyeddie
February 25th, 2015, 04:34 AM
I have owned many of the RD Aerial skates, purchased only for their wheels, but did skate one pair long enough to know that heir suspensions are crappy and their internally threaded axle tip scheme, which relies on nylon coated bolts to hold the wheels on, is dubious at best, and a definite safety threat.

Have you ever lost a front wheel on the push foot while rolling at decent speed? Say hello to a face plant and perhaps a few more broken ribs when that happens. In my case it was only rib cage muscle tear and ligament damage, but the few sneezes I endured as things healed felt exactly like a sword going right though my body.

-Armadillo

Thanks for the tip. I thought those bolts looked suspect. I have some old Marathon trucks that may fit, but after reading your thoughts on their suspensions, I may be back to the drawing board.

I never lost a wheel at full speed, but I did implode a wheel doing a jump. I was going backwards and did a simple 1/2 revolution, and the front pivot wheel imploded. Didn't get hurt, just embarrassed. Embarrassed, because at first I didn't realize that the wheel imploded, so as I got up to skate away, I fell again.

Oh, and the sneezes... More painful than the actual break. At least I'm at the point where I can sleep laying down and not sitting up in a chair.

steadyeddie
February 28th, 2015, 01:29 PM
Imploding wheel.

http://i405.photobucket.com/albums/pp133/SteadyEddie1/IMG_0320_zpsncwc4nnx.jpg
http://i405.photobucket.com/albums/pp133/SteadyEddie1/IMG_0323_zpsifoqnp3h.jpg

Bunny_Hop
March 12th, 2015, 12:04 AM
I currently skate on super-cheap wheels that come with these cheap art/outdoor/recreational skates called Starfires (I don't have those skates, but there is a place in Australia that sells the wheels). I bought them initially because I'd just spent over $400 on skates and wanted to try outdoor skating without another huge cost outlay. They are surprisingly quite good (I mean, they're the only thing I've skated outdoors but I certainly don't find it difficult to skate in them) and I've bought another set. They are 58mm "high-rebound polyurethane", no specified hardness, about 35mm wide I think.

I use them for path skating and practicing art outdoors, as they are similar dimensions to my indoor art wheels. When I have the money I'd love to upgrade to Atom Pulses for cycle path skating, as some of the paths are quite bumpy in the Starfires, but they would probably be too wide for any art practice. And I wouldn't want to change my wheels that much - I have a phobia that it'd damage the axles somehow - yeah, I think I am getting to the limit of what's realistic in one skate. :/

I'd love to get another pair of skates the same as my current ones (Variant M + Edea boot, for the heel plus their sizing works for me which is rare), and have them with Atom Pulse wheels in the mixed colours, just for cycle path skating. :D The more "realistic" version of this is I am keeping my eye out for anyone selling off old Starfires as the plates aren't bad apparently (it is a $120-ish skate but the plates are metal!!), then sticking those plates onto a better boot, probably a low-end Edea, and eventually Atom Pulse wheels. Working my way up to the dream haha. :rolleyes:

oldspeedskater67
March 12th, 2015, 08:19 PM
Has anyone skated the hyper strada hellboys? I was thinking about trying a set.

pvasques
March 16th, 2015, 02:39 AM
NUMBER ONE - Hyper Strada Tom Petersons
NUMBER TWO - Krypto Classic K - 76mm 78A

Hands down

The rest impossible to find!

Try Hellium or the Zombies.... nice canadian made wheels!

Cheers

oldspeedskater67
March 17th, 2015, 07:38 PM
Has anyone skated these. They are cheap, but they look so much like the old velocity race wheels. I was thinking about trying a set.

http://www.rollerskatenation.com/heartthrob-speed-wheels-w-bearings-set-of-8/8251/?catargetid=120141860000021453&cadevice=t&gclid=CjwKEAjwoZ-oBRCAjZqs96qCmzgSJADnWCv8vHOzM-QeklTlP6o4JTJDbrF1asdxffwSrxOXdmbaMxoClQnw_wcB#.VQhy6Ef3arU

Mamaskates
March 17th, 2015, 09:14 PM
Has anyone skated these. They are cheap, but they look so much like the old velocity race wheels. I was thinking about trying a set.

http://www.rollerskatenation.com/heartthrob-speed-wheels-w-bearings-set-of-8/8251/?catargetid=120141860000021453&cadevice=t&gclid=CjwKEAjwoZ-oBRCAjZqs96qCmzgSJADnWCv8vHOzM-QeklTlP6o4JTJDbrF1asdxffwSrxOXdmbaMxoClQnw_wcB#.VQhy6Ef3arU

No, but at that price, it is certainly worth a try. Thank you for the link!

HoneyBeeoftheValley
March 17th, 2015, 09:45 PM
Keep us posted if you try them out. A good, cheap outdoor wheel would be nice to know about. :)

oldspeedskater67
March 17th, 2015, 11:43 PM
I bought a set. I called and talked to a person. She said they are kinda hard, prolly 94a. Time will tell, it sure would be nice, if they are like the old velocity wheels.

Armadillo
March 18th, 2015, 02:55 AM
I bought a set. I called and talked to a person. She said they are kinda hard, prolly 94a. Time will tell, it sure would be nice, if they are like the old velocity wheels.

They look like they have the same oversize 12-spoke hubs as the MAGNUM wheels.
They are extremely lightweight, but much too hard, and at 94A, the grooves will wear off in no time, shrinking the OD down to 62mm in a hurry, and leaving too little urethane thickness.

Keep them for indoor if they have any decent grip.

Get Zombie Hawg 76mm 84A and they will outperform nearly all outdoor wheels.
Plus, they last 2-3 times longer as well.

-Armadillo

HoneyBeeoftheValley
March 18th, 2015, 05:19 PM
But don't those have to be cut down? What if you don't have the tools? Also are those good for noobs? Why not the 78A?

oldspeedskater67
March 18th, 2015, 05:24 PM
They look like they have the same oversize 12-spoke hubs as the MAGNUM wheels.
They are extremely lightweight, but much too hard, and at 94A, the grooves will wear off in no time, shrinking the OD down to 62mm in a hurry, and leaving too little urethane thickness.

Keep them for indoor if they have any decent grip.

Get Zombie Hawg 76mm 84A and they will outperform nearly all outdoor wheels.
Plus, they last 2-3 times longer as well.

-Armadillo

For the price I'm going to try them. I have a lot of indoor wheels. All my rinks I skate have grip, and I use 97 and up. I'm using a set of early 80's Blazers outdoor now. I also have a set of poisons coming I'm going to use outdoors. I don't care for the real soft wheels. The lady I talked to said they were firm, and she liked road hogs for outdoor, which are nice, but really soft for me. I contacted a guy on eBay, and he said he sells a lot of them to guys who skate outdoors. I'm 195 and currently skating avenger plates outdoors. Considering going to a probe for vibration. I know the harder the wheel the more vibration. Trying to find that happy medium. Need to find a smooth place to skate.lol

steadyeddie
March 18th, 2015, 10:08 PM
Has anyone used Poisons outdoors?

oldspeedskater67
March 19th, 2015, 05:15 AM
Has anyone used Poisons outdoors?

I have a friend that uses them all the time outside. Usually buys the derby girls wheels when they get worn. I got a deal on a new set of the aluminum cap poisons. 69.00 shipped. Prolly should have stuck with the all plastic hub, but for the same money I picked the aluminum cap.

Armadillo
March 19th, 2015, 06:01 AM
For the price I'm going to try them. I have a lot of indoor wheels. All my rinks I skate have grip, and I use 97 and up. I'm using a set of early 80's Blazers outdoor now. I also have a set of poisons coming I'm going to use outdoors. I don't care for the real soft wheels. The lady I talked to said they were firm, and she liked road hogs for outdoor, which are nice, but really soft for me. I contacted a guy on eBay, and he said he sells a lot of them to guys who skate outdoors. I'm 195 and currently skating avenger plates outdoors. Considering going to a probe for vibration. I know the harder the wheel the more vibration. Trying to find that happy medium. Need to find a smooth place to skate.lol

If you time yourself on a closed loop, I doubt that any wheel firmer than 86A will roll faster than a a high rebound quality wheel like the Z-Hawgs 76mm.
Rebound is the key for having a soft wheel be able to out roll a hard wheel.
Got to be narrower too with 30-32mm near optimum (heavier skater => wider wheel)

-Armadillo

okcskater
March 20th, 2015, 12:30 AM
Maybe should have read thru this thread earlier. Just got in so Atom Pulse 65mm 78A wheels to put on my R3's to get outside, for now. Not sure if any bigger would have fit. Still plan to piece some things together in the future for out door skating, but other than switching wheels back and forth, these should get me going for now. Also got all the needed gear including a bum saver to protect this old body!

oldspeedskater67
March 23rd, 2015, 02:38 PM
I tried out the cheap wheels that look like velocitys. They are hard. They skate ok. I sprayed some carb cleaner in the bearings a little to remove some of the grease. It is a double sided closed bearing. It improved the roll. They do have some big grooves on them. Lol. They are about 1/2 gone now. They seem to improve after the grooves starting wearing. They have plenty of grip for me. Decent speed. The bearings are ABEC 5. Can't expect much for 25.00.lmao the loop I skate has it all. Some smooth, rough, gator back, lots of gravel from a kids play area getting kicked on the trail. Some 90* right angle turns. Even have to cross the road twice.lol They ran right over small sticks no problem. anyway for 25.00 they skate ok.. Somewhere that is smooth I'm sure they would do better. Didn't go all out, because of debri. Gps said max speed 16 mph. If you have kids that skate outside they would be fine. I skated 6.5 miles on them, and I'm going to keep skating them on the crappy trail I'm currently skating.

Armadillo if I keep skating outdoors, I will get me some zombie hawgs. The poisons came, but almost seems like a waste to skate them outside. They are soft though.

Armadillo
March 23rd, 2015, 05:21 PM
I tried out the cheap wheels that look like velocitys. They are hard. They skate ok. I sprayed some carb cleaner in the bearings a little to remove some of the grease. It is a double sided closed bearing. It improved the roll. They do have some big grooves on them. Lol. They are about 1/2 gone now. They seem to improve after the grooves starting wearing. They have plenty of grip for me. Decent speed. The bearings are ABEC 5. Can't expect much for 25.00.lmao the loop I skate has it all. Some smooth, rough, gator back, lots of gravel from a kids play area getting kicked on the trail. Some 90* right angle turns. Even have to cross the road twice.lol They ran right over small sticks no problem. anyway for 25.00 they skate ok.. Somewhere that is smooth I'm sure they would do better. Didn't go all out, because of debri. Gps said max speed 16 mph. If you have kids that skate outside they would be fine. I skated 6.5 miles on them, and I'm going to keep skating them on the crappy trail I'm currently skating.

Armadillo if I keep skating outdoors, I will get me some zombie hawgs. The poisons came, but almost seems like a waste to skate them outside. They are soft though.


Seems like they did well for as hard as they are, but realize they will wear out a whole lot faster than a softer wheel, because the more abrasive outdoor rolling surface can dig in and shred harder urethane faster than softer urethane, which squirms away from being penetrated as easily as hard urethane allows.

At least they must have been good for their light weight. The Z-Hawgs cant compete in that category.

-Armadillo

HoneyBeeoftheValley
March 23rd, 2015, 07:25 PM
Aren't poisons indoor/outdoor? I'll most definitely do the same, switch wheels until I can afford separate pairs of skates. Still plenty of snow on the ground here so I have time to save up.

oldspeedskater67
March 23rd, 2015, 08:07 PM
Aren't poisons indoor/outdoor? I'll most definitely do the same, switch wheels until I can afford separate pairs of skates. Still plenty of snow on the ground here so I have time to save up.

Snow, yuk. I think we are done with snow. Might get a few flurries, but spring is here. Trees have some buds, grass is getting green.

Yes poisons are indoor/outdoor wheels. They feel nice and soft. Great for a slick rink. A lot of derby girls use them for the grip. I have a friend that is very fast on them outdoors, BUT they are still small diameter wheels. On smooth blacktop, tennis courts I think they would be excellent. Where I'm skating I think I like the taller wheels. After a couple of laps I didn't even think about rolling over little sticks. I did hit one good size rock. Left about a 14" scrape in the concrete. I also skated a few laps around the B Ball court. "Concrete". that was nice, and smooth. The place I'm skating is less than 10 min from my house, so hard to beat.

HoneyBeeoftheValley
March 23rd, 2015, 08:38 PM
Looks like I might need to get a couple of outdoor sets then, because there's a nice concrete rink/skate park right up the street from my house that I'd like to use to practice dance/jam (which one is it that Roller Dance Man, et al do? I get confused.) But then I also would like to do some skating on local bike paths and roads. I assume these need different wheels.

steadyeddie
March 23rd, 2015, 09:36 PM
They look like they have the same oversize 12-spoke hubs as the MAGNUM wheels.
They are extremely lightweight, but much too hard, and at 94A, the grooves will wear off in no time, shrinking the OD down to 62mm in a hurry, and leaving too little urethane thickness.

Keep them for indoor if they have any decent grip.

Get Zombie Hawg 76mm 84A and they will outperform nearly all outdoor wheels.
Plus, they last 2-3 times longer as well.

-Armadillo

I can't fit 76mm wheels on my plates, so I'm thinking of getting the 2013 Mini Zombie Hawgs 70mm. I found a site that has the 84A's for $30 a set of four, and free shipping.

http://www.nordboards.com/landyachtz-70mm-mini-zombie-hawgs-2013-longboard-wheels.html?productid=landyachtz-70mm-mini-zombie-hawgs-2013-longboard-wheels&channelid=FROOG

HoneyBeeoftheValley
March 23rd, 2015, 09:49 PM
I can't even find the info on how large a wheel I can fit on my plate (PowerDyne Thrust). Did you just measure something yourself? Or try a set?

oldspeedskater67
March 23rd, 2015, 10:08 PM
I can't fit 76mm wheels on my plates, so I'm thinking of getting the 2013 Mini Zombie Hawgs 70mm. I found a site that has the 84A's for $30 a set of four, and free shipping. [/url]


I bought some too. Thanks for the link. For 60 bucks hard to beat.

Armadillo
March 23rd, 2015, 10:20 PM
I can't fit 76mm wheels on my plates, so I'm thinking of getting the 2013 Mini Zombie Hawgs 70mm. I found a site that has the 84A's for $30 a set of four, and free shipping.

http://www.nordboards.com/landyachtz-70mm-mini-zombie-hawgs-2013-longboard-wheels.html?productid=landyachtz-70mm-mini-zombie-hawgs-2013-longboard-wheels&channelid=FROOG


I bought some too. Thanks for the link. For 60 bucks hard to beat.

Be aware that the Mini-Hawgs often must be machined on BOTH the inside and the outside because they are only partially "side set" on the inside and protrude inward there enough to hit the truck platform.

If you have extra long axles you can space them out wider to prevent truck contact, but this will increase your wheel spread.

So for optimum outdoor performance, many will need to narrow the wheel on BOTH sides -inside a bit for trucl clearance and outside for narrowing thecontact patch & reducing the weight.

http://i489.photobucket.com/albums/rr259/RRLedford/Wheels/MiniZombieHawgs/20120620_203925.jpg

-Armadillo

oldspeedskater67
March 23rd, 2015, 11:06 PM
No problem. They are to wide anyway. I will cut them down. I was also looking at the ABEC 11 flywheels. They seem to have the similar reviews. 76 mm is the smallest they come. I could turn them down, besides narrowing them. I just don't think I will be comfortable with a 76mm wheel.
Appreciate the heads up tho.

steadyeddie
March 23rd, 2015, 11:17 PM
Be aware that the Mini-Hawgs often must be machined on BOTH the inside and the outside because they are only partially "side set" on the inside and protrude inward there enough to hit the truck platform.

If you have extra long axles you can space them out wider to prevent truck contact, but this will increase your wheel spread.

So for optimum outdoor performance, many will need to narrow the wheel on BOTH sides -inside a bit for trucl clearance and outside for narrowing thecontact patch & reducing the weight.

-Armadillo

Thanks for the heads-up. Why cut the outside? How wide is the contact patch? Can't find any info.

Time to invest in a lathe. Mrs. Steady is going to be thrilled. :eek:

Armadillo
March 23rd, 2015, 11:20 PM
No problem. They are to wide anyway. I will cut them down. I was also looking at the ABEC 11 flywheels. They seem to have the similar reviews. 76 mm is the smallest they come. I could turn them down, besides narrowing them. I just don't think I will be comfortable with a 76mm wheel.
Appreciate the heads up tho.

If you can turn down the OD, then I advise you use the 76mm Z-Hawgs and take them down to whatever OD is the max you can handle.

I doubt that the ABEC-11 will perform as well, but I haven't tried them.
The many skaters for whom I have narrowed the Z-Hawg so far have all reported that they did not believe how well they roll outdoors, and that they never even considered it could possible to reach this level of quad skate wheel performance outdoors.

-Armadillo

oldspeedskater67
March 24th, 2015, 01:21 AM
If you can turn down the OD, then I advise you use the 76mm Z-Hawgs and take them down to whatever OD is the max you can handle.

I doubt that the ABEC-11 will perform as well, but I haven't tried them.
The many skaters for whom I have narrowed the Z-Hawg so far have all reported that they did not believe how well they roll outdoors, and that they never even considered it could possible to reach this level of quad skate wheel performance outdoors.

-Armadillo


I know 70mm is a stretch for me. Lol the 64mm I felt like I was on stilts, and the width being a lot smaller.lol
That all sounds great, I hope I'm impressed with them. So far the old school early 80's red blazer has been the smoothest. Small diameter tho. I read the skate boarders love the zombie hawgs. They are smooth, and still slide, and when they slide it is smooth, even on rougher blacktop. Biggest complaint was how they wear from them sliding them, which won't be a problem for me. I don't hockey slide outside. I'm looking for a fast smooth wheel.

okcskater
March 24th, 2015, 08:24 PM
Well, as I explore the out door skating world. My Atom Pulses work great at the park. Smooth cement. Skated back to the truck on the parking lot asphalt. Not going to do that much. Rougher than a cob, and catchy. Obvious thing would be larger diameter wheels for street skating? The pulses are 65mm. They are 78A as well.

oldspeedskater67
March 29th, 2015, 01:39 AM
Armadillo, just wanted to say thanks about the zombie hawgs. I bought the mini hawgs. You were correct I had to take a little off the back side to get clearance of the truck. I left the front alone for now, but going to remove some as I go. I just skated around a my concrete drive, but wow they are smooth, and roll great. They are heavy lol, but very impressed. I could tell when I removed material from the back side, they are a tuff material compared to other wheels I have cut. Just wanted to say thanks!!!!

Roy

Armadillo
March 29th, 2015, 02:33 AM
Armadillo, just wanted to say thanks about the zombie hawgs. I bought the mini hawgs. You were correct I had to take a little off the back side to get clearance of the truck. I left the front alone for now, but going to remove some as I go. I just skated around a my concrete drive, but wow they are smooth, and roll great. They are heavy lol, but very impressed. I could tell when I removed material from the back side, they are a tuff material compared to other wheels I have cut. Just wanted to say thanks!!!!

Roy

You're very welcome.
As you gradually narrow them more, they will only get even better.
Their urethane is super smooth and springy. On top of that it is very tough and durable. You will likely get around 2000 miles or more of the best outdoor skating of your life on these, and you will also soon be shopping for a new plate that handles the 76mm Z-Hawgs, because they are even better than the Mini-Hawgs.

The Hawgs are so good, they almost make me cry tears of joy when I skate them. I am telling you guys to not even bother wasting your time with all the other outdoor wheels people consider to be good. Once you roll Hawgs, you know you've rolled the wheels of your dreams.
Only thing that could make them much better is a 5-6mm larger OD hub.

- Armadillo

oldspeedskater67
March 29th, 2015, 02:57 AM
Currently Im using using avenger plates, so I can go 76 mm no problem. I will prolly get the 76mm later. Get another set of mini's so both my sons will have mini's. For now I'm going to roll these. My knees will be happier. :-)

oldspeedskater67
March 31st, 2015, 12:44 AM
Skated the mini zombie hawgs twice today for a total of 10.4 miles. They are very smooth. They are heavy. I don't think my knees would like the extra weight of the 76mm. I can see why guys narrow them, just removing some extra weight would good. The area I'm skating is an area I quit skating, because it is kinda rough. Now it will work fine. I timed my lunch time 10k, and smoked the time on the old wheels. I wasn't trying to see how fast I could do it, just that is was so much easier to skate. I'm hooked

okcskater
April 1st, 2015, 04:10 PM
Going to save my pennies and look into the 76mm Hawgs. I can see where they would be a good improvement over the 65mm Atom's I have now when I get out on the asphalt bike path.

oldspeedskater67
April 9th, 2015, 07:45 PM
Well I. It the bullet and bought a set of the 76mm zombie hawgs. I skated them, and they are a touch smoother than the 70mm mini. They are really heavy in stock form. The weight aggravated my knees. The pavement was wet, and I had no slippage with the full width. I put them on my machine, and cut them down to 39.5mm wide. Looking for that happy medium. Armadillo goes to 35, but I don't run any wheels that narrow. So far everything he says about the zombies are right on!!!! I see no reason to look for another outdoor wheel.
Thanks again armadillo!!!

Armadillo
April 9th, 2015, 11:02 PM
Well I. It the bullet and bought a set of the 76mm zombie hawgs. I skated them, and they are a touch smoother than the 70mm mini. They are really heavy in stock form. The weight aggravated my knees. The pavement was wet, and I had no slippage with the full width. I put them on my machine, and cut them down to 39.5mm wide. Looking for that happy medium. Armadillo goes to 35, but I don't run any wheels that narrow. So far everything he says about the zombies are right on!!!! I see no reason to look for another outdoor wheel.
Thanks again armadillo!!!

You are very welcome!
I share everything I discover that improves my skating reality, and so that everyone has access to the best possible outdoor skating experience.

Good wheels are a critical factor to accomplishing that, and while there may be equal performing outdoor wheels to the Z-Hawgs, I doubt there are any that can perform much better. Yes, the 76mm are heavy, but there will soon be a larger hub option for outdoor quad wheels in the 50-55mm range, and this will make a big difference with the weight.

-Armadillo

oldspeedskater67
April 10th, 2015, 12:37 AM
That would be a big difference with a bigger hub, and less thane. Going to skate shortly with narrowed wheels.


The urethane, or what ever this compound actually is, has a super rebond. I dropped a wheel and it was like a dropped a super ball. It bounced and went flying.lol

I skated them after narrowing. They are even better. Lighter, and easier on my knees. Also the maneuverabilty, and speed improved.

Mort
April 10th, 2015, 01:15 AM
That would be a big difference with a bigger hub, and less thane. Going to skate shortly with narrowed wheels.


The urethane, or what ever this compound actually is, has a super rebond. I dropped a wheel and it was like a dropped a super ball. It bounced and went flying.lol


Rebound quality is highly overlooked in quad skates.

I'm sure you can understand that 2 wheels that were exactly the same profiles and hardness would feel drastically different if one had very good rebound. This shows quality urethane and good crosslinking.

Good urethane loses less rebound as it is hardend with a catalyst. Though after 75 to 85 A rebound starts to fall off, but a quality hard wheel will still bounce around like a ball does where poor quality falls like a chunk of hard plastic.

Where you really feel rebound differences is in the same euro wheel on a slightly rough asphalt. One will seem like it rolls much better.

chuckboucher
April 22nd, 2016, 03:28 PM
Since I'm getting a 2nd pair of skates, I'm thinking of making my older skates outdoor skates.

SinCitySkates.com has the Radar Flyer 66x38 78A wheels for $56/set. Since I probably can't fit a 70mm wheel on my skates (standard downward mounting hardware w/ exposed nuts), I think 66mm is probably the biggest wheels I'll fit. I'll probably have to lathe out a groove on the inside.

The Eastern Seaboard Series in Trexlertown PA runs a quad category in its annual series. I may give that a go as well.

Armadillo
April 22nd, 2016, 08:28 PM
Since I'm getting a 2nd pair of skates, I'm thinking of making my older skates outdoor skates.

SinCitySkates.com has the Radar Flyer 66x38 78A wheels for $56/set. Since I probably can't fit a 70mm wheel on my skates (standard downward mounting hardware w/ exposed nuts), I think 66mm is probably the biggest wheels I'll fit. I'll probably have to lathe out a groove on the inside.

The Eastern Seaboard Series in Trexlertown PA runs a quad category in its annual series. I may give that a go as well.

For what plate are you planning this outdoor skate makeover?
Trust me that you really want to have at least 70mm OD & high rebound wheels for the best outdoor skating, and if this means upgrading your plate mount to T-nut with button head screws then, by all means, do it.
****Even if it takes using FLAT HEAD screws and countersinking the plate holed to get a couple more mm of clearance for the 70mm wheels to fit, you really should even do that!!!

Keep in mind the fact that wheels wear a lot faster outdoors than indoors, and their ODs will drop faster than you may think. A 65-66mm outdoor wheel often becomes a 62mm indoor size wheel after just a few hundred miles.

PIC of T-nut mount using 7075 anodized aluminum screws (green was out of stock):
http://i489.photobucket.com/albums/rr259/RRLedford/PumaKing-SuperNova/20130927_031631_zpscb783985.jpg

-Armadillo

chuckboucher
April 22nd, 2016, 08:33 PM
For what plate are you planning thisoutdoor makeover?
Trust me that you really want to have at least 70mm OD & high rebound wheels for the best outdoor skating, and if this means upgrading your plate mount to T-nut with button head screws then, by all means, do it.

Even if it takes using FLAT HEAD screws and countersinking the plate holed to get a 70mm wheel to fit, you really should so it.Since I skate inline outdoors, transferring the quad skates over to outdoor will be a novelty. The skates are Reidell 911 w/ Roll-Line Mistral plates. The skates are fairly heavy as they sit. (no gm scale to weigh them)

Armadillo
April 23rd, 2016, 02:49 AM
Since I skate inline outdoors, transferring the quad skates over to outdoor will be a novelty. The skates are Reidell 911 w/ Roll-Line Mistral plates. The skates are fairly heavy as they sit. (no gm scale to weigh them)

Even a cheap good quality plate like a SG Nova would make a better outdoor build plate candidate than those Mistrals likely will, depending on what style outdoor quad skating you plan to be doing.

-Armadillo

chuckboucher
April 23rd, 2016, 04:06 PM
Even a cheap good quality plate like a SG Nova would make a better outdoor build plate candidate than those Mistrals likely will, depending on what style outdoor quad skating you plan to be doing.I like my setup and don't plan on changing anything but the wheels. Like I said, I'm primarily an inline skater outdoors, so it's not like I will be doing this all the time. The events I may participate in will be for fun and not to be competitive.

Armadillo
April 24th, 2016, 05:16 AM
I like my setup and don't plan on changing anything but the wheels. Like I said, I'm primarily an inline skater outdoors, so it's not like I will be doing this all the time. The events I may participate in will be for fun and not to be competitive.

When you say you like your setup, can I assume that means you already skated them outdoors on indoor wheels? If not, then you may find that thier outdoor performance is not as likable as it was indoors, even with good outdoor wheels. Remounting plate more forward by ~1/2" plus would also be helpful, if it is to be an outdoor only use build.

-Armadillo

chuckboucher
June 16th, 2016, 02:58 AM
Well, I finally got to skate outdoors on my Radar Flyers (I know, I've had them for a couple of months now). I really like them. They're smooth and fast on the rail trail that I skate and were even smoother over the rooted areas than my inlines are (most likely because the trucks act as suspension and inlines don't have suspension).

However, I am going to try a little larger and harder wheel by going to a set of Orangatang Kilmer longboard wheels. They're 69mm in diameter and 46mm wide w/ a 39.5mm contact patch. I felt a little unstable on the 38mm Flyers and I hope that the Kilmers aren't too wide. I opted for the 80a durometer orange wheels. If they don't work out, I'll just have a couple of sets of wheels for my longboards.

Alakablamo
June 16th, 2016, 01:13 PM
Those wheels are center-set, not side-set, so be careful. I'm not sure they will fit. From what I have read, basically all of the Orangatang wheels need to be machined in some manner for proper fit, even the Kegel on the inside.

Well, I finally got to skate outdoors on my Radar Flyers (I know, I've had them for a couple of months now). I really like them. They're smooth and fast on the rail trail that I skate and were even smoother over the rooted areas than my inlines are (most likely because the trucks act as suspension and inlines don't have suspension).

However, I am going to try a little larger and harder wheel by going to a set of Orangatang Kilmer longboard wheels. They're 69mm in diameter and 46mm wide w/ a 39.5mm contact patch. I felt a little unstable on the 38mm Flyers and I hope that the Kilmers aren't too wide. I opted for the 80a durometer orange wheels. If they don't work out, I'll just have a couple of sets of wheels for my longboards.

chuckboucher
June 16th, 2016, 01:58 PM
Those wheels are center-set, not side-set, so be careful. I'm not sure they will fit. From what I have read, basically all of the Orangatang wheels need to be machined in some manner for proper fit, even the Kegel on the inside.Rats, I hadn't thought of that. Looks like I need to find a machinist to take a few mm off of the insides of the wheels.

chuckboucher
June 18th, 2016, 03:18 PM
Those wheels are center-set, not side-set, so be careful. I'm not sure they will fit. From what I have read, basically all of the Orangatang wheels need to be machined in some manner for proper fit, even the Kegel on the inside.And you were definitely right. The center-set wheels didn't even come close on my Snyder Advantage trucks, which are 2mm wider on each side than the Roll-Line trucks I plan on using outdoors.

Edit: I have decided to return the Orangatang wheels and grab a set of 70mm 78a Landyachtz Mini Zombie Hawgs. I don't mind the additional width.

Armadillo
June 18th, 2016, 03:44 PM
And you were definitely right. The center-set wheels didn't even come close on my Snyder Advantage trucks, which are 2mm wider on each side than the Roll-Line trucks I plan on using outdoors.

Edit: I have decided to return the Orangatang wheels and grab a set of 70mm 78a Landyachtz Mini Zombie Hawgs. I don't mind the additional width.

The Mini Z-Hawgs are not a true side set wheel hub either; they are a slight hub OFF SET on the inside, and will likely need at least 2-4mm trimmed off there.

I will check the Advantage plate I have to confirm fit.
It is worth asking here on compatibility concerns before pulling trigger on purchases, as many of have already gone down same tunnels, often having to also retreat.

OK → I checked and the Mini Z-Hawgs should fit with 1-2mm clearance from the hitting the truck's cushion platform without any cutting.

-Armadillo

chuckboucher
June 18th, 2016, 05:28 PM
The Mini Z-Hawgs are not a true side set wheel hub either; they are a slight hub OFF SET on the inside, and will likely need at least 2-4mm trimmed off there.

I will check the Advantage plate I have to confirm fit.
It is worth asking here on compatibility concerns before pulling trigger on purchases, as many of have already gone down same tunnels, often having to also retreat.

OK → I checked and the Mini Z-Hawgs should fit with 1-2mm clearance from the truck's axle stub end without any cutting.

-ArmadilloI would actually prefer to use them on my Roll-Line plates, but if they're that close when using an Advantage truck, it will most likely hit the Roll-Line truck.

Edit: Or, I can add a 1mm spacer before mounting the wheels. I have them in there for the Flyers anyway.

Armadillo
June 18th, 2016, 06:03 PM
I would actually prefer to use them on my Roll-Line plates, but if they're that close when using an Advantage truck, it will most likely hit the Roll-Line truck.

Edit: Or, I can add a 1mm spacer before mounting the wheels. I have them in there for the Flyers anyway.

Yeah, the spacer behind the wheel can solve that issue, as long as adequate axle protrusion is available. Remember these are longboard wheels, and the hub design has bearings spaced further out.

This is another good reason to get the Downhill Bomber bearings, since their free spacers would likely match the bearing spacing of Mini Z-Hawgs' hub dimension, except for the fact that the Roll Line axles are likely going to be a 7mm mismatch to the Rush hybrid bearing's ID.

-Armadillo

chuckboucher
June 18th, 2016, 06:06 PM
Yeah, the spacer behind the wheel can solve that issue, as long as adequate axle protrusion is available. Remember these are longboard wheels, and the hub design has bearings spaced further out.

This is another good reason to get the Downhill Bomber bearings, since their free spacers would likely match the bearing spacing of Mini Z-Hawgs' hub dimension, except for the fact that the Roll Line axles are likely going to be a 7mm mismatch to the Rush hybrid bearing's ID.

-ArmadilloI don't use spacers in my quad wheels at all. I don't know of many that do. Mainly because you use a nylock nut and don't fully tighten them down.

Inlines are a different story. I use spacers in all of my inline wheels, because you have to tighten the axles all the way down.

Armadillo
June 18th, 2016, 06:36 PM
I don't use spacers in my quad wheels at all. I don't know of many that do. Mainly because you use a nylock nut and don't fully tighten them down.

Inlines are a different story. I use spacers in all of my inline wheels, because you have to tighten the axles all the way down.

When you move into the realm of rolling on longboard wheels, their hubs having a typically wider (than quad wheels) 0.4" internal bearing spacing, means that your axle nuts will not as fully engage with the axle threads.

Depending on the amount of axle length available, this can be a problem, but if spacers are in place and axle nuts are torqued hard against the bearing H/W "stack," then the potential insufficient grip of the nylon is no longer a concern.

Having trucks with extra length available on their axles is always a good thing when switching over to longboard wheels.

-Armadillo

chuckboucher
June 22nd, 2016, 05:30 PM
Looks like my skates will be swapping duties for a little while. The Mini Zombie Hawgs did not fit on the more narrow Roll-Line trucks, even with a 1mm spacer on the inside of the wheel. Most likely, the retaining nut would have had only a thread or two to grab onto anyway when using the spacing washer.

So, my nice clean, new Bont/Snyder setup will be pulling outdoors. I did end up using spacers in the wheels, since the axles were a bit short for the longboard wheels and the nuts were required to be flipped over (a MAJOR pain to get them on in this direction) and tightened down.

I will be carrying a 7/16" nut driver with me, since I do not think any of the aluminum threads in the nylock nuts contact the axle threads. I may be wrong, since they did tighten down quite a bit.

Since the plates were mounted with t-nuts, there won't be any clearance issues with the 70mm OD wheels.

https://s31.postimg.org/rvel01pfv/thumb_IMG_1699_1024.jpg

chuckboucher
June 23rd, 2016, 01:00 AM
Well, my love for outdoor quad skating may die quickly. I tried the new wheels on the new skates and wasn't very impressed. Mostly because I didn't trust that the nuts weren't going to back out and lose a wheel.

Also, since I didn't have any 7mm bearing spacers long enough to fit the larger bearing spacing of the longboard wheels, I used self-centering inline spacers, which were long enough, but as soon as a nut did give a little, the spacers rattled around. It sounded like I have Mexican jumping beans in my wheels.

So, two questions before I give up on longboard wheels altogether:

1) Does anyone make a 7mm spacer that will fit properly inside longboard wheels without having to mill them?

2) Are there any alternatives to the nylock nuts for the 9/32-32 Snyder axles? (maybe old-school loose-ball lock nuts?)

Armadillo
June 23rd, 2016, 05:49 AM
If the bearing spacer is wide enough to crank the axle nut tight, then a nylon insert lock nut is not required. You could just use a thin 9/32-32 "speed nut" and put a drop of loctite blue on it. Should stay tight if it is well torqued and the Loctite hardens.


Proper 0.4" width sized spacers are more readily available for 8mm axle size than 7mm axle size, which was why I suggested getting a set of 8mm 608 bearings to go with the Mini Z-Hawgs, but then you would need to put 7mm X 8mm axle sleeve on the Snyder 7mm axles and they usually suck for having a poor fit to both 7mm axle OD and to the 7mm bearing IDs.

-Armadillo

chuckboucher
June 23rd, 2016, 04:35 PM
If the bearing spacer is wide enough to crank the axle nut tight, then a nylon insert lock nut is not required. You could just use a thin 9/32-32 "speed nut" and put a drop of loctite blue on it. Should stay tight if it is well torqued and the Loctite hardens.


Proper 0.4" width sized spacers are more readily available for 8mm axle size than 7mm axle size, which was why I suggested getting a set of 8mm 608 bearings to go with the Mini Z-Hawgs, but then you would need to put 7mm X 8mm axle sleeve on the Snyder 7mm axles and they usually suck for having a poor fit to both 7mm axle OD and to the 7mm bearing IDs.

-ArmadilloWell, this is getting too complicated for what I need them for. So, I'm going to post the new Hawg for sale and go back to the Radar Flyer wheels that worked fairly well.

Live and learn.

yedaki_de
June 24th, 2016, 12:06 PM
I used different kinds of longboard wheels over the years without spacers on Rolline-Axles and had never missed them.

The original nuts fit fine without a spacer disc, only I use a tiny bit of Loctite 243 from time to time.

BUT: You have to cut the wheels on the inside, which is no big deal and you
dont have to deal with any of the difficulties.

Or you buy Zombie Hawgs 76mm they fit out of the box.

Johannes

chuckboucher
June 24th, 2016, 01:59 PM
I used different kinds of longboard wheels over the years without spacers on Rolline-Axles and had never missed them.

The original nuts fit fine without a spacer disc, only I use a tiny bit of Loctite 243 from time to time.

BUT: You have to cut the wheels on the inside, which is no big deal and you
dont have to deal with any of the difficulties.

Or you buy Zombie Hawgs 76mm they fit out of the box.

JohannesI tried the 70mm and they didn't fit very well. I don't have access to anyone with a lathe, so I'd have to send them, which I don't want to do.

I'm happy w/ the Radar Flyers, so I'm going to stick with them.

Armadillo
June 24th, 2016, 02:16 PM
Looks like my skates will be swapping duties for a little while. The Mini Zombie Hawgs did not fit on the more narrow Roll-Line trucks, even with a 1mm spacer on the inside of the wheel. Most likely, the retaining nut would have had only a thread or two to grab onto anyway when using the spacing washer.

So, my nice clean, new Bont/Snyder setup will be pulling outdoors. I did end up using spacers in the wheels, since the axles were a bit short for the longboard wheels and the nuts were required to be flipped over (a MAJOR pain to get them on in this direction) and tightened down.

I will be carrying a 7/16" nut driver with me, since I do not think any of the aluminum threads in the nylock nuts contact the axle threads. I may be wrong, since they did tighten down quite a bit.

Since the plates were mounted with t-nuts, there won't be any clearance issues with the 70mm OD wheels.


I am still not clear why you thought you needed to reverse the nylon insert axle nuts (yes it is a pain to get them started reversed)?

If you have proper sized and fitted bearing spacers inside the wheels, the nylon grip of a normal axle nut is not required, since the higher torque tightening alone can keep the nut in place with the higher friction developed from greater compression of the stack of items on the axle being crushed by the nut.

In fact, when the amount of nut to axle thread engagement is minimum, you DON'T want to have the nylon side of nut going on first, as it cannot be properly torqued to a high enough level, without stripping the nylon, to safely secure the wheels on the axles.

Put the metal side of nut on 1st, torque them down TIGHT and leave the nylon side sticking out. Friction from high torque will hold them on, and you can also add the drop of Loctite, for peace of mind, if you like.

I suggest at least two full turns of metal to metal engagement is needed for applying a safely high enough level of torque, without stripping the metal thread.
As the amount of thread engagement drops, the peak nut torque must be reduced accordingly, and adding the Loctite becomes a greater concern.

If tightly torquing the wheels against the trucks triggers any of their bearing balls to start being pinched, and those wheels to stop spinning freely, then they will need more width for their bearing spacers to be added with thin, shim washers. Hopefully, that doesn't happen, because it is just another tedious task to be added to an overall tedious project.

-Armadillo

chuckboucher
June 24th, 2016, 02:27 PM
I am still not clear why you thought you needed to reverse the nylon insert axle nuts (yes it is a pain to get them started reversed)?

If you have proper sized and fitted bearing spacers inside the wheels, the nylon grip of a normal axle nut is not required, since the higher torque tightening alone can keep the nut in place with the higher friction developed from greater compression of the stack of items on the axle being crushed by the nut.

In fact, when the amount of nut to axle thread engagement is minimum, you DON'T want to have the nylon side of nut going on first, as it cannot be properly torqued to a high enough level to safely secure the wheels on the axles.

Put the metal side of nut on 1st, torque them down TIGHT and leave the nylon side sticking out. Friction from high torque will hold them on, and you can also add the drop of Loctite, for peace of mind, if you like.

If tightly torquing the wheels triggers any to cause their bearing balls to start being pinched, and wheels to stop spinning freely, then more width for that bearing spacer must be added with thin shim washers. Hopefully that doesnt happen.

-ArmadilloThe point is that I do NOT have proper spacers and finding a 7mm x 10mm spacer is next to impossible (ask me how I know).

Roller skate bearing spacing is 8mm, while longboard bearing spacing is 10mm (as you're aware of). I do not have access to a machinist, so I'm S.O.L.

I used 8mm self-centering inline wheel spacers, wince they are also 10mm (why isn't there a standard across the board here?). I then turned the nylock nuts around. Unfortunately, a few backed out and all I heard from those wheels was the rattling of the bearing spacers as they became loose. So, I lost faith in the setup.

I'm not a fan of loctite. It gums up threads. I'm also not a fan of 8mm-7mm reducers for the reasons you stated. I also do not have extra 8mm bearings. Although, I have extra sets, they are all allocated to inline wheels for different purposes (indoor practice set [1x12], indoor meet sets [2x12], outdoor sets [2x12]) and I rarely remove them, unless I get new wheels or do bearing maintenance.

Armadillo
June 24th, 2016, 02:38 PM
The point is that I do NOT have proper spacers and finding a 7mm x 10mm spacer is next to impossible (ask me how I know).

Roller skate bearing spacing is 8mm, while longboard bearing spacing is 10mm (as you're aware of). I do not have access to a machinist, so I'm S.O.L.

I used 8mm self-centering inline wheel spacers, wince they are also 10mm (why isn't there a standard across the board here?). I then turned the nylock nuts around. Unfortunately, a few backed out and all I heard from those wheels was the rattling of the bearing spacers as they became loose. So, I lost faith in the setup.

I'm not a fan of loctite. It gums up threads. I'm also not a fan of 8mm-7mm reducers for the reasons you stated. I also do not have extra 8mm bearings. Although, I have extra sets, they are all allocated to inline wheels for different purposes (indoor practice set [1x12], indoor meet sets [2x12], outdoor sets [2x12]) and I rarely remove them, unless I get new wheels or do bearing maintenance.

I have used a sardine can to make spiral rolled up axle sleeves for fitting 8mm spacers on a 7mm axle. Once you figure out the correct rectangle size to cut and find the right diameter rod on which to roll the rectangle it is fairly easy.

This rolled sleeve only needs to keep the spacer roughly centered, not perfect, and the 8mm spacer end will still overlap with the 7mm inner races enough to lock the wheels on the axle without a nylon nut.

-Armadillo

chuckboucher
June 24th, 2016, 03:09 PM
I have used a sardine can to make spiral rolled up axle sleeves for fitting 8mm spacers on a 7mm axle. Once you figure out the correct rectangle size to cut and find the right diameter rod on which to roll the rectangle it is fairly easy.

This rolled sleeve only needs to keep the spacer roughly centered, not perfect, and the 8mm spacer end will still overlap with the 7mm inner races enough to lock the wheels on the axle without a nylon nut.

-ArmadilloToo much work. IMO, if it doesn't work OOTB, it's not meant to work.

chuckboucher
May 2nd, 2017, 02:25 AM
Anyone ever try Cult Classic wheels? They come in 70x46 (30mm contact patch) and 66x45 (34mm contact patch), both are 80a and backset.

I'm thinking they'd stick out the side pretty far. It's odd that the smaller diameter wheels have the larger contact patch.

ascar larkinyar
May 2nd, 2017, 03:57 AM
I like these. 65 x 30, 78A

Wear good and feel fast on rough to normal outdoor conditions. Fairly inexpensive. Plastic core.

https://www.instagram.com/p/BTku3x1DXR4/

Sorry I only have link for a pic.

chuckboucher
June 15th, 2017, 02:42 AM
OK, has anyone ever tried to mill down the front portion of the hub of a longboard wheel to make the spacing between the bearings less so that they fit better on 7mm quad axles and be able to use the nylock nuts the way they should be? Is it even possible to do it so that the bearings sit properly?

HeBeGB
June 15th, 2017, 09:21 AM
OK, has anyone ever tried to mill down the front portion of the hub of a longboard wheel to make the spacing between the bearings less so that they fit better on 7mm quad axles and be able to use the nylock nuts the way they should be? Is it even possible to do it so that the bearings sit properly?

Yep, I have. I made a jig, then make sure the wheels (Zombie Hawgs in this case) were running true, the rest is being REALLY careful and taking small cuts to push the bearing seat back. :)

Mort
June 16th, 2017, 06:55 PM
Yep, I have. I made a jig, then make sure the wheels (Zombie Hawgs in this case) were running true, the rest is being REALLY careful and taking small cuts to push the bearing seat back. :)


So, you tried the hawgs eh? What duro and size? How do they compare to your wheels with scotties thane for outdoor?

I wanna get those sector 9 lumithane wheels narrowed for outdoor night use. Lol

chuckboucher
June 20th, 2017, 01:54 PM
Going to give these bad boys a try. Rider Approved Designs (RAD) Glide 70mm, 80A. They have rounded edges that give a 30mm contact patch. They're also sideset, so no wheel griding is required. The bearing spacing also seems to be a tiny bit smaller, as I'm able to get bite on the nylon portion of the nylock nuts without modifying anything. The wheels also come in 78A (white) and 82A (blue) hardness. I grabbed the set of 8 on Amazon for $67, shipped. (have to check back often, as pricing on Amazon changes quite frequently on different items)

https://s3.postimg.org/hck2xhyeb/RAD3.jpg

https://s3.postimg.org/4mkfy5ftv/RAD4.jpg

chuckboucher
June 21st, 2017, 12:15 AM
. . . aaaand I finally foiund my outdoor wheels. The RAD Glide wheels were awesome. Rolled them for 12 miles today on our new rail trail that included a bunch of wet leaves and gypsy moth caterpillar crap and had no issues whatsoever. (the moth caterpillars are horrid this year)

The narrow contact patch made for a faster roll and the rounded profile actually felt better than a squared profile does IMO. I rolled the 12 miles in just under 45 minutes, which is a hair above 16mph average, which is actually as fast as I roll my 3x125mm inlines on average.

Mort
June 22nd, 2017, 07:09 PM
. . . aaaand I finally foiund my outdoor wheels. The RAD Glide wheels were awesome. Rolled them for 12 miles today on our new rail trail that included a bunch of wet leaves and gypsy moth caterpillar crap and had no issues whatsoever. (the moth caterpillars are horrid this year)

The narrow contact patch made for a faster roll and the rounded profile actually felt better than a squared profile does IMO. I rolled the 12 miles in just under 45 minutes, which is a hair above 16mph average, which is actually as fast as I roll my 3x125mm inlines on average.

Good to know!

AZSHOT
June 24th, 2017, 02:21 AM
My daughter is loving a set of old, red Kryptonics Kryptos. But using them indoors too!

Sulla
July 15th, 2017, 10:59 PM
I am going to have to try the Rider Approved Designs (RAD) Glide 70mm, 80A.

What other wheels that are 70-90mm and are still in production and do not need modified to work on most skates?

I have the Kryptonics 70mm skate wheels but looking for more options and cheaper prices are better haha.

Has any one tried these? It is a long shot they would be decent but they do look to be all the way side set and are cheap. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Set-of-4-Black-8044-80A-80mm-PU-Wheels-for-Longboard-Skateboard-Flywheels-/142434971127?hash=item2129c92df7:g:t1AAAOSwrfVZW1iL

chuckboucher
July 16th, 2017, 04:36 AM
Has any one tried these? It is a long shot they would be decent but they do look to be all the way side set and are cheap. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Set-of-4-Black-8044-80A-80mm-PU-Wheels-for-Longboard-Skateboard-Flywheels-/142434971127?hash=item2129c92df7:g:t1AAAOSwrfVZW1iLWould you trust your life to a spoked Chinese-made wheel?

gotsk8s
July 16th, 2017, 08:07 PM
Right now I have 2:
Hyper Strada and Hyper Strada Tom Peterson

maltoch
July 17th, 2017, 01:41 AM
i'm a big fan of the krypto red new route 82a 70mm.
i bought like new krpyto road runner 78a 70mm wheels...same in performance...but lighter.
so i would put them in first position...but really close to new route krypto wheels...for cheap it's the wheel to go....a little bit harder than cruise ...but that's why they roll...

i hope i will found a nice set of hyper strada tp , krypto project tp 2 or a hyper super mundo.

kp tp 2 ..are the easiest to find...hyper strad tp...harder and super mundo..siccc...so difficult .

if soemone are ok to exchange...he's welcome...i have a rare set of french krpyto...the famous krpytoto..and velocitiy races wheels too.

Sulla
July 20th, 2017, 01:34 AM
Would you trust your life to a spoked Chinese-made wheel?

You might over estimate the speed I am going to be achieving :)

gotsk8s
July 20th, 2017, 03:37 AM
i'm a big fan of the krypto red new route 82a 70mm.
i bought like new krpyto road runner 78a 70mm wheels...same in performance...but lighter.
so i would put them in first position...but really close to new route krypto wheels...for cheap it's the wheel to go....a little bit harder than cruise ...but that's why they roll...

i hope i will found a nice set of hyper strada tp , krypto project tp 2 or a hyper super mundo.

kp tp 2 ..are the easiest to find...hyper strad tp...harder and super mundo..siccc...so difficult .

if soemone are ok to exchange...he's welcome...i have a rare set of french krpyto...the famous krpytoto..and velocitiy races wheels too.
Forgot to mention Velocity Race. Have 2 sets, 1 still in the blister pack. Their roll is awesome but not so great for the surfaces I roll.

maltoch
July 20th, 2017, 09:13 AM
i have fewer sets of velocity race...not as good as krpyto roadrunner and new krypto route.

how is the krypto project 2 wheel compared to roadrunner ? can you tell me ?
and how is the hyper strada tp compared to kp 2 and rr wheels ?

gotsk8s
July 22nd, 2017, 10:44 PM
i have fewer sets of velocity race...not as good as krpyto roadrunner and new krypto route.

how is the krypto project 2 wheel compared to roadrunner ? can you tell me ?
and how is the hyper strada tp compared to kp 2 and rr wheels ?

This is only my opinion. The only difference I saw was the fact that my Stradas were 65mm tall and the Krypts were 70mm. I didn't like that height difference and plus that plays into the rebound effect of the thane too so ... I think if the hub had a been a bit bigger I could've gotten used to 5mm diff in height.