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Quad Speed Discussions about speed skating in quad roller skates.

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Old May 19th, 2008, 05:09 PM   #1
Armadillo
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Default Quad Wheels: Outdoor Marathon on roads

I am doing a couple of outdoor skate marathons this summer using QUADs.
Can anyone tell be about best Quad wheel options for speed on decent asphalt?

I am currently using very lightweight Velocity Race 65x35mm 78A wheels, and will likely move up to the 70mm size, if I can find them and make them fit. These have preformed well for me outdoors, but I do not have much wheel knowledge. I do not like HEAVY wheels like the Krypto 70mm ones. There really do not appear to be very many options for lightweight softer big diameter Quad wheels.
-Armadillo

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Old May 19th, 2008, 06:07 PM   #2
Live2sk888
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I think the challenge with long distance skating on quads is to use a hard enough wheel to get the roll and speed you will want, without getting so hard that the road vibration is unbearable. The surface you're skating on matters too, obviously if it is a very smooth trail, you can use a harder wheel.

I haven't skated on Velocities but they sound good in general, based on the fact they they are a soft compound on a large hub, which is a good compromise between roll and grip/comfort.

From what I remember, the Hyper Stradas were one of the more popular wheels for that type of racing back when outdoor quad races still existed. They are 88a. I have a 62mm set but I think they came in a bigger size also, maybe 64? If you can still find some of those, give them a try. They were great to skate on and just about impossible to wear out. Hyper also made Pistas which are the same size/profile as indoor speed wheels and are hard (96a-100a), those were made specifically for banked track/smooth concrete racing. (I think using a set of maybe 93a indoor wheels would be preferable to those if you are on anything other than smooth concrete but still wanting a harder wheel than most outdoor wheels.)

There are also the Roll Line Hydrogen and Helium which are 80a-84a and are 64mm size which would be nice for the extra roll. Design looks a lot like the Velocities. If I was about to skate a marathon, I would definitely consider these... I haven't tried them myself so I can only base that recommendation on the size/hardness/design of the wheel.

The new Anabolix wheels would be worth a try too, they are around 88a just like the old Stradas, and on the large aluminum hub which makes them roll well.

I haven't really messed with 70mm wheels myself, the fit issue is somewhat of a a turnoff, plus so few wheels are available in that size other than Kryptos, which are too soft for my preference. But I agree it would be nice to have that size for a marathon, if you could get some good wheels in that size.
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Old May 19th, 2008, 08:56 PM   #3
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PM Merlin, I think he still races quads outside a little.
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Old May 19th, 2008, 10:32 PM   #4
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Cool wheels

hey armadillo, if you can't find any older wheels then the roll line stuff is probably the best newer stuff. i'm just guessing but i know there quality is good. you might be able to find some old outdoor jumbo jets if you look. i know broken joe had some but weather he'll sell them is another story. the anobolix would work! but for a marathon i think the'd beat your feet to death. the'd be great on the smooth trac. but for the road they'd be awful hard. primo deano use to make some nice outdoor wheels to. but i think i'd take oldnslows advice and pm merlin! he's big into outdoor quads and should know excatly what you need. good luck! hey go win the thing!
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Old May 19th, 2008, 11:33 PM   #5
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Hi,

I also do distances with quads and I am using currently the Krypto Classic in 76mm and blue color, those has 80a.

http://www.skatelogforum.com/forums/...&postcount=647

Also I have got a set Rolline Helium. They are fine if you skate on good surface without any little stones etc. But if you have those pebbles and dirt they block quite easy.

For the average streetsurface in Germany I am a bit faster with the Kryptos. For the additional weight I get a nice smooth roll and little stones just pushed away. Almost no blocking. They have about 165g each. Same as the 70mm.
But they dont fit on any plate so you have to check first.

I read a lot at the longboarding-pages about different urethane etc. so my next wheel will be the Speed-Vent in 77mm and 83a. Acording to seismic-founder Dan Gesmer it is made from new formula-urethane, better then the standard and it gets good reviews.

http://www.seismicskate.com/products_wheels.html

http://www.silverfishlongboarding.co...m/Speed_Vents/

Of course they are to wide, I have to trimm it to the shape I desire. But for real distances for me it seems the ultimative wheel.

I made a quick sketch of my idea how to shape it. Sorry for the bad quality.


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Old May 19th, 2008, 11:58 PM   #6
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^^^ really cool ideas!
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Old May 20th, 2008, 02:24 AM   #7
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I haven't raced quads outdoors for years and years....BUT when we were, we all used wheels that were universally known as Jeds, after the skater that used to import and sell them here (they came from Italy, I think).

The thing is, the wheels carried no branding what so ever and look nothing like your typical indoor wheel. I'll post photos later - when I get home from work. There were hubless, high rebound wheels in the mid to high 80's duro, to small plastic hubbed tyres in the 90's duro, and at the top of the pops, 100A duro wheels that were 90% hub and 10% tyre.

As I said earlier, this is all ancient history now - I very much doubt you would find such a wheel for sale in this day and age. Which is why I'm hoarding mine The only commercial wheels I can think of were Cruciani's - they made a good selection back in the 80's there.

My only general comment is that indoor wheels are NOT really suitable for outdoor use. Yes, they 'work', but they're not ideal. If you can locate some 'old skool' outdoor wheels, then great, but that will be quite a challenge I think. As for hardness, for marathon distances the softer, high rebound wheels are generally the best - think 88a or thereabouts.
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Old May 20th, 2008, 06:37 AM   #8
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Default Thanks for all the good info guys!

I think the Roll-Line Helium at 64mm and 83A are about the best I can do, short of doing one of Johannes costom shaped hi-tech-formula urethane skateboard wheel modification projects.

Both the Helium and the Hydrogen wheels look very similar to the Velocity wheels (only they have 8 spokes where the velocity has 12). The design seems to be ultra lightweight with a thin layer of urethane, just as merlin describes the older Italian wheels were made back in the day.

I'll post some comparisons between them. I'm sure DOC would like to hear that his big inventory of Velocity wheels compares favorably with the Roll-lines.

Anyone have some thoughts about groovin' the wheels for speed on the road?
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Old May 20th, 2008, 06:48 AM   #9
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Some simple rules for quad road wheels:

1. Grooves are pointless.
2. Strength rules over weight
3. Hubless wheels are almost always junk
4. Choose the hardest wheel you can tolerate
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Old May 20th, 2008, 10:04 PM   #10
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Cool agree

i agree with merlin!
and armadillo you might find out the velocities are as good as anything nowadays! but i still think your going to like the bigger bearings better! good luck and skate good!

bob.
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Old May 21st, 2008, 03:39 AM   #11
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Default What are the Roll-Line special Micro bearings about?

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i agree with merlin!
and armadillo you might find out the velocities are as good as anything nowadays! but i still think your going to like the bigger bearings better! good luck and skate good!

bob.
Thanks for the encouragement bob!

Well the idea of choosing from a whole range of normal size bearing options does sound very appealing!
But what is the special "FITS-ONLY-ROLL-LINE-HUBS" micro bearings package that is hyped with their wheels at sites that sell their wheels?
What is the engineering concept that Roll-Line has in mind with their Micro Bearing option for fitting ONLY THEIR wheels?
-Armadillo
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Old May 21st, 2008, 03:49 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Armadillo View Post
What is the engineering concept that Roll-Line has in mind with their Micro Bearing option for fitting ONLY THEIR wheels?
Do you remember Betamax tapes? :-)
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Old May 21st, 2008, 04:04 AM   #13
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Cool +1

i agree with bill, but doc will know for sure he's the roll line guy! but if i'm not mistaken there just micro bearings! acually they should be very similer to the ones in your velocities! i have some bont micro bearings but buy the time i used bearing sleeves and all that junk just to use any wheel they weighed about the same so i went back to normal size bearings. i believe roll line offer both size hubs? but i'm not the roll line guy, doc is. some of the other folks might know if they make a regular hub!
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Old May 21st, 2008, 04:41 AM   #14
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The Roll Line Micro Bearings are built into a sleeve which makes them fit into a standard bearing hole. The reason they don't work on all plates is because some trucks will interfere with the sleeve around the bearings, it sticks out a little past the bearing.

You can't use them on the threaded axles that take nuts to hold them in the trucks, I tried that but they rub. However, they work fine on Prolines. It just depends on the truck you are putting them on. They are sweet bearings though.
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Old May 21st, 2008, 05:01 AM   #15
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Default Fitting Micro-baering sleeve to truck

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Originally Posted by Live2sk888 View Post
The Roll Line Micro Bearings are built into a sleeve which makes them fit into a standard bearing hole. The reason they don't work on all plates is because some trucks will interfere with the sleeve around the bearings, it sticks out a little past the bearing.

You can't use them on the threaded axles that take nuts to hold them in the trucks, I tried that but they rub. However, they work fine on Prolines. It just depends on the truck you are putting them on. They are sweet bearings though.
Wouldn't the sleeve that carries the micro-bearing mount on the side of the bearing that's AWAY from the truck end? I can see where a fully threaded axle having just a truck nut without a precision SMALL washer against it would be dragging against the seal face.

So the idea is that a plastic carrier sleeve is lighter than the bigger steel of a normal bearing, and a smaller bearing can roll with slightly less drag.

Sounds like a marginal concept at best, especially knowing they can probably tolerate a lot less abuse than normal size bearings would. Maybe for indoor only use they could make sense. -Armadillo
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Old May 21st, 2008, 10:30 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Armadillo View Post
Sounds like a marginal concept at best, especially knowing they can probably tolerate a lot less abuse than normal size bearings would. Maybe for indoor only use they could make sense. -Armadillo
For the harder and rougher outdoor-use I also dont see any advanage of those micro-bearings with sleeves.
Normal 608 or 627 bearings fit on my Helium-wheels, any more in between makes the thing weak...

Johannes
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Old May 22nd, 2008, 03:22 PM   #17
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Hey Armadillo,
I've got a set of Vanguard Outdoor Jumbo Jets (road) if your interested. PM me and we can discuss.
They are 66mm, 88a, with a narrower profile than the indoor Jumbo Jets (haven't measured to get exact width though). But back in the day these kicked some serious a$$, rolled extremely well & shot rocks out from under them like nobody's business!! These wheels were put out for road racing when Tom Peterson, Bobby Kaiser & Dean Huffman were tearing up the World Championships.
I had the unfortunate experience of racing and outdoor race at the Birmingham Classic in like '83 on Krypto's and got lapped by Mr. Kaiser on a 1.75 kilometer course!! Not braggin' but I was definetely not a World Class skater, I just had a hell of a good time!!
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Old May 22nd, 2008, 08:45 PM   #18
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Cool good wheels

+1 on the outdoor jumbo jets! now thats a racing wheel! yeah baby!
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Old May 23rd, 2008, 05:49 AM   #19
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Default They sound special to me

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Hey Armadillo,
I've got a set of Vanguard Outdoor Jumbo Jets (road) if your interested. PM me and we can discuss.
They are 66mm, 88a, with a narrower profile than the indoor Jumbo Jets (haven't measured to get exact width though). But back in the day these kicked some serious a$$, rolled extremely well & shot rocks out from under them like nobody's business!! These wheels were put out for road racing when Tom Peterson, Bobby Kaiser & Dean Huffman were tearing up the World Championships.
I had the unfortunate experience of racing and outdoor race at the Birmingham Classic in like '83 on Krypto's and got lapped by Mr. Kaiser on a 1.75 kilometer course!! Not braggin' but I was definetely not a World Class skater, I just had a hell of a good time!!
BrokenJoe,
I will PM you on those wheels.
I did just order a set of Roll-line Heliums today, and at 64mm/83A they will not quite match your Jumbo Jets. Since I already have 65x35mm/78A Velocities, and I am considering getting 70x35mm Velocities from DOC if he has some, your Jumbo Jets at 66x??mm/88A would top out the high end of the range nicely.
This could give me a good feel for how both wheel size and formula affect speed skating on roads. I'm most interested how much the harder wheels on rough surfaces affect how many miles my feet can take? Thanks,
-Armadillo
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Old May 24th, 2008, 12:40 AM   #20
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Default 6Hours Race Carole

Here are some french quad-rollers, wich attended the 6 hour race.
A lot photos prove, they are quite strong.
Most of them have the 76mm Krypto-Classic with core, like I have also.
But they have those in 78a, mine are 80a.
One of the quad-skaters has the Radar Pure.

http://translate.google.de/translate...hl=de&ie=UTF-8

I like to see Quad-Skaters at such events

Johannes

Last edited by yedaki_de; May 25th, 2008 at 12:09 AM.
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