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Old November 3rd, 2009, 07:33 PM   #1
Kathie Fry
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Default Make the advertising forum post only? (no change for now)

I'm thinking about making the advertising forum threads "one post only" and requiring that all discussions between buyers and sellers be done via private message or email. Sellers would be allowed to edit the body of their posts to change prices or add information and they could also edit their subject lines and mark items SOLD, but no one (including the seller) could reply to any of the "for sale" posts.

What do you think?

- Kathie

Last edited by Kathie Fry; November 3rd, 2009 at 08:52 PM.
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Old November 3rd, 2009, 07:42 PM   #2
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Sounds like a good idea. That would cure a lot of problems and get rid of the clutter. I think that discussions about actual transactions, between buyer and seller, should be by e-mail or PM instead of a page full of conversations.
I think that your recent changes are going in the right direction.
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Old November 3rd, 2009, 07:58 PM   #3
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I agree, things have a way of getting out of hand at times. I think it would be a good idea.
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Old November 3rd, 2009, 08:00 PM   #4
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(and I know I'm new here)

I think you've done a great thing breaking down the for sale section and instilling some new rules to be followed. That being said I think we need to be able to reply to for sale post openly. There are a few things that come to mind that could occur if we can't reply.

1) sellers passing sales along to friends as opposed to selling them in the order they were inquired about.

2) knowing your sale discussions will be on public display keeps both sellers and buyers on the straight and narrow

3) new members will be more hesitant to join in if contributing to a for sale thread is made difficult as well as private (You and I know how to use the PM or private messaging system but others might not heck they may not even know what PM means)

4) Multiple questions about the same thing on one for sale thread IE insole measurements, wheel A ratings, wheel base lengths ect...

I think maybe give it a few weeks and see how the new changes effect your advert section. You may have already fixed the problem as well as sent the message that your not playing games anymore, if people continue with the childish antics there will be repercussions and more changes will be made.

just my take on it.

Anyway thanks for all the hard work you've been putting in on the site I love it here and don't see myself leaving anytime soon

oh on a different note I just wanted to add that all of the other forums that I visit charge an annual fee for advertising on the site. This is the only one that's free and we should all appreciate the time and effort that you and other administrators voluntarily devote to the site...contributions may not be a bad idea
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Old November 3rd, 2009, 08:20 PM   #5
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Default one more thought

I just remembered that the one site I visit quite often changed there classified section so bumps only move it on the "New Post" list and in the sub forum they just stay where they are. When they made this change they also made it mandatory that you wait three days before relisting your item to move it to the top of the list. They also get a lot more for sale threads so three days will put you on like page 6 but in the same breath most of it is just the same old stuff being listed over and over again....sad

just something I thought I'd mention
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Old November 3rd, 2009, 08:27 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smokin_Endo View Post
(and I know I'm new here)

I think you've done a great thing breaking down the for sale section and instilling some new rules to be followed. That being said I think we need to be able to reply to for sale post openly. There are a few things that come to mind that could occur if we can't reply.

1) sellers passing sales along to friends as opposed to selling them in the order they were inquired about.

2) knowing your sale discussions will be on public display keeps both sellers and buyers on the straight and narrow

3) new members will be more hesitant to join in if contributing to a for sale thread is made difficult as well as private (You and I know how to use the PM or private messaging system but others might not heck they may not even know what PM means)

4) Multiple questions about the same thing on one for sale thread IE insole measurements, wheel A ratings, wheel base lengths ect...

I think maybe give it a few weeks and see how the new changes effect your advert section. You may have already fixed the problem as well as sent the message that your not playing games anymore, if people continue with the childish antics there will be repercussions and more changes will be made.

just my take on it.

Anyway thanks for all the hard work you've been putting in on the site I love it here and don't see myself leaving anytime soon

oh on a different note I just wanted to add that all of the other forums that I visit charge an annual fee for advertising on the site. This is the only one that's free and we should all appreciate the time and effort that you and other administrators voluntarily devote to the site...contributions may not be a bad idea
+1 nice post Brian... i was thinking the exact same thing!
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Old November 3rd, 2009, 08:37 PM   #7
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I understand why it's nice sometimes to have public discussions, but eliminating all replies would sure eliminate a lot of problems. You make some good points, so let me comment...

Quote:
1) sellers passing sales along to friends as opposed to selling them in the order they were inquired about.
There's nothing to stop that from happening now. Just because replies *can* be public, doesn't mean they always are. There are plenty of behind-the-scenes discussions going on now.

Quote:
2) knowing your sale discussions will be on public display keeps both sellers and buyers on the straight and narrow
If buyers or sellers are having serious problems they can share them in the "Advertising Forum Problems and Issues" forum. More then keeping buyers and sellers on the straight and narrow, the public discussions have too often resulted in public and very ugly flame throwing wars.

Quote:
3) new members will be more hesitant to join in if contributing to a for sale thread is made difficult as well as private (You and I know how to use the PM or private messaging system but others might not heck they may not even know what PM means)
Sellers who are concerned about this can post their skate shop phone numbers or skate shop email addresses in their ads. (In case you haven't figured it out yet, most of our sellers have skate shops, and several of them represent the same shop or set of shops). Individual sellers can create free gmail or yahoo email addresses to use in their "for sale" ads, if they want to keep their personal email addresses private.

Quote:
4) Multiple questions about the same thing on one for sale thread IE insole measurements, wheel A ratings, wheel base lengths ect...
If sellers don't want to receive multiple questions about the same issue they should update their ad by editing it everytime a question is asked. Or better yet, include more information in the first place. Too many ads include almost no information.

Just my $.02...

- Kathie
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Old November 3rd, 2009, 08:41 PM   #8
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Quote:
one site I visit quite often changed there classified section so bumps only move it on the "New Post" list and in the sub forum they just stay where they are
Sorry, but I just don't see a need for any bumping. Am I missing something obvious here?

- Kathie
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Old November 3rd, 2009, 09:27 PM   #9
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Default you did ask what we thought

OK I can see you have your mind made up and I'm in no way trying to cause waves or change what you think is the right way to handle this

I was just making a few examples as to what may come in the future given that you take away the reply feature of the for sale threads. I'm in your house and will do things what ever way you see fit...end of story

and to answer your question about the need for bumps well that's on a different site and they have a larger volume of traffic sometimes things end up on the forth or fifth page before anyone has a chance to see them and in that case a bump to the top is a not a problem but yes we deal with the same problems as you do here with way too many people bumping there own thread to the top far to often...sometimes four or five times a day and the way they fixed the problem was to make all sale threads stationary. A bump no longer moves them so a relist every few days if your items are still available is standard practice. They also have other rules about small talk and listing individual items in multiple threads as opposed to all your items in one sale thread to keep the topic count down.

thanks for taking the time to respond
Brian
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Old November 3rd, 2009, 09:46 PM   #10
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I sort of like some of the discussion that goes with some of those threads... it is sometimes helpful when someone chimes in and says, "those were mine," or "those sometimes have bent axles," etc.

I don't think I would have tried NMB bearings if it weren't for discussion in the for sale section, but everyone seemed to say nice things about them, and now I have a bunch of sets!

Just my two pennies....
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Old November 3rd, 2009, 09:59 PM   #11
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Quote:
a relist every few days if your items are still available is standard practice
Posting the same item for sale twice is not an acceptable alternative to bumping in this forum. The main reason ads disappear from page #1 so fast in this forum is that skate shop owners are bumping their own ads, and posting several new ads per day, and and all of those posts are burying the ads posted by skaters selling their own stuff. If the skate shop owners keep it up, we will have to limit the number of ads per day, week, or month that each skate shop or seller is allowed to post.

Here's what skate shop owners can do instead: They can use the new What's New at Skate Shops subforum to tell us about their latest sales, specials, and products.

- Kathie
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Old November 3rd, 2009, 10:08 PM   #12
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Quote:
I don't think I would have tried NMB bearings if it weren't for discussion in the for sale section, but everyone seemed to say nice things about them, and now I have a bunch of sets
I'd rather see discussions about the pros and cons of skates and bearings in our regular forums, not in the advertising forum, where threads are deleted when items are sold. As long as you are not buying, selling, or advertising, it's fine to compare skates and skating products in our regular forums. I wouldn't want to see those discussions start moving to the advertising forums.

My suggestion: Before anybody buys anything in the advertising forum, they should search the entire SkateLog Forum for discussions and opinions about that product. You can either use the built-in vBulletin Search Engine or the Google SkateLog Forum Search. We have discussions in our forum about nearly every skating product ever made.

- Kathie
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Old November 3rd, 2009, 10:57 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kathie Fry View Post
I'd rather see discussions about the pros and cons of skates and bearings in our regular forums, not in the advertising forum, where threads are deleted when items are sold. As long as you are not buying, selling, or advertising, it's fine to compare skates and skating products in our regular forums. I wouldn't want to see those discussions moving to the advertising forums.

My suggestion: Before anybody buys anything in the advertising forum, they should search the entire SkateLog Forum for discussions and opinions about that product. You can either use the built-in vBulletin Search Engine or the Google SkateLog Forum Search. We have discussions in our forum about nearly every skating product ever made.

- Kathie
I agree with you Kathie about doing your homework before you buy. I also agree about the shameless bumps for the products (Ive been guilty of this as well as others.) I do how ever think its better for the buyer to see discussion on the product if someone raises a question.

For example.

I posted a set of Orange cannibal wheels. I posted pics and description to the best of my ability. I also put a question mark next to the country of origin. I had 2 or three people reply that those were defiantly made in the USA and were a good deal..
I think that's a good thing.

It could have been the other way with people saying, 'wow those same wheels just sold for $25 and you might want to reconsider the price'. All in all I think feed back is a positive thing.It kind of keeps us all in check..

Here's a thought,
I have seen phpBB mod the forums so topics will be listed at date of creation and not date of last thread. Maybe that could be looked to on here with v-bulletin (hope that makes since)
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Old November 3rd, 2009, 11:01 PM   #14
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I'm torn.... I like the "idea" of both no replies and replies allowed.

I am OK with whatever you decide!
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Old November 3rd, 2009, 11:47 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Nathan_ View Post
I agree with you Kathie about doing your homework before you buy. I also agree about the shameless bumps for the products (Ive been guilty of this as well as others.) I do how ever think its better for the buyer to see discussion on the product if someone raises a question.

For example.

I posted a set of Orange cannibal wheels. I posted pics and description to the best of my ability. I also put a question mark next to the country of origin. I had 2 or three people reply that those were defiantly made in the USA and were a good deal..
I think that's a good thing.

It could have been the other way with people saying, 'wow those same wheels just sold for $25 and you might want to reconsider the price'. All in all I think feed back is a positive thing.It kind of keeps us all in check..

Here's a thought,
I have seen phpBB mod the forums so topics will be listed at date of creation and not date of last thread. Maybe that could be looked to on here with v-bulletin (hope that makes since)
Here is another nice example of a positive reply.
http://www.skatelogforum.com/forums/...ad.php?t=23347
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Old November 3rd, 2009, 11:56 PM   #16
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replies in my mind help alot in sales and people that have owned it before normally say it was theirs and is in great shape... or sometimes show a problem in it... you learn alot about an object when people are talking about it when its for sale then in the quad section... ontop of the pm box only being 100 messeges if you have a very questionable object or a popular one you pm box will be full quickley and mine is normally pretty close to full... just sounds like a hassle in the long run... the for sale section didnt take up much server space when you deleted all the old stuff i see no reason in making it smaller... plus it is going to make a huge hassle because then the person that bought it cant say hey i just bought this making it easyer for some of us getting ripped off
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Old November 4th, 2009, 12:06 AM   #17
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Quote:
people that have owned it before normally say it was theirs and is in great shape
One of the problems we have experienced, is that users have been team-tagging each other in the advertising forums by posting "great product" type replies to each other's advertising posts. In fact it appears some of the users in our advertising forum were created for the sole purpose of doing just that (replying to another person's advertising posts to bump them or to compliment the seller on their excellent product). This kind of thing can make replies more misleading then informative for innocent buyers. Just another example of the kind of behavior we have been dealing with in the advertising forum.

- Kathie
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Old November 4th, 2009, 01:34 AM   #18
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Quote:
ontop of the pm box only being 100 messeges if you have a very questionable object or a popular one you pm box will be full quickley and mine is normally pretty close to full...
Maybe Kathy can add a PM button so you can let the seller know you tried to pm them when there pm box is full.
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Old November 4th, 2009, 01:55 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kathie Fry View Post
The main reason ads disappear from page #1 so fast in this forum is that skate shop owners are bumping their own ads, and posting several new ads per day, and and all of those posts are burying the ads posted by skaters selling their own stuff. If the skate shop owners keep it up, we will have to limit the number of ads per day, week, or month that each skate shop or seller is allowed to post.

-Kathie
I dont think the majority of sales going on are from skate shop owners. Its mostly just from forum members who are selling used equipment. Yes i own a skate shop but i do not post ads all the time about my products for sell on my website...unless ive done updating to prices or products i never do. However i do sale used personal items on here from time to time... but i have to assume OffTheEdge is the prime suspect on this one!
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Old November 4th, 2009, 11:54 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kathie Fry View Post
I'm thinking about making the advertising forum threads "one post only" and requiring that all discussions between buyers and sellers be done via private message or email. Sellers would be allowed to edit the body of their posts to change prices or add information and they could also edit their subject lines and mark items SOLD, but no one (including the seller) could reply to any of the "for sale" posts.

What do you think?

- Kathie
That sounds like the most fair way to me.
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