outdoor build ideas

[purlingwood]

So far, i got riedell 220 in 9 wide and atom pulsr 65wheels. I got sure grip super x size 7 plates laying around.

I am 5'10" 190 lbs. Id like to skate in tennis courts and occasional asphault bike paths. Im getting artistic lessons weekly, but rythmn skate mostly.

My indoor skates are 297's on mistral plates with cheapie pacesetter wheels.

I prefer 8mm axles.

If you could advise a plate and placement, that would be great.

[Mort]

I like to toe in and heel out. So basically my toes can sit slightly pointed outwards while my skates roll straight. The axle sits as far forward as I can get it without flipping the plate backwards or running NTS.

Since I have a bit more inline placement on the plates of my quads I can skate at about 20 to 25mph with my quads and 25 to 30 in my rec inlines on a sprint.

If your going outdoors, the plastic plates do a fine job, they are cheap and help dampen vibrations better than metal plates do. Richard glues skates together, and I have done 1 skate which does a fantastic job outdoors. I didnt glue the plate to the boot to follow Richard, but to help with the firmness and resistance to torque for virtually no cost.

All I did was sand the sole of a size 10 carrera, took the largest probe plate available(size 9 i think) and sanded the top where it will meet the plate and applied a super thin layer of shoe goo to the boot and the plate. I used a c large clamp , a wrench and a piece of wood to put on the trucks so a lot of pressure coukd be used to press out excessive shoe goo. That excess was smeared around the plate and boot merger like caulking for sinks and crap. Let it dry/cure for 2 days then removed the clamp.

Athletic shoes do a really good job for mounting plates. Soccer, football, rugby, virtualky anything that has good lateral supports. They all are very lightweight, and can be found for very cheap compared to skate boots. Also you can usually try them on before you buy them

After they fit super good and are broken in well if you want a stiffer lateral reinforcement, shoe goo and a layer of canvas do a good job too. The reinforcement is pretty much custom if its laid on a shoe thats already fitted to your foot. I did a repair on a kids GT50 at the rink and she talked about how crazy comfortable it is now.

[Fancy-Kerrigan]

Plate placement.....
With a size 9 boot and a size 7 plate (7 inches from axle to axle) It seems that there would not be a great deal of space in front of or behind the plate to play with placement.
I skate a men's size 10 paired with a 6.5 inch plate. Hubby mounted it perfectly more toward the back. I have a very easy time getting up on my toes and staying there. As I get older I find that a shorter plate is a lot more fun. I've tossed around the idea of going with a 6.25.....maybe when I win the lottery

[purlingwood]

I went with the 7 plates on my 9 boots. I'll see how they work. I like short plates on the rink. I might like not falling due to a pebble or twig more.

If i don't like them, I'll try another.

I did notice how much easier it is getting on my toes wirh the mistral plates on my indoor pair.

[Fancy-Kerrigan]

Originally Posted by purlingwood

I went with the 7 plates on my 9 boots. I'll see how they work. I like short plates on the rink. I might like not falling due to a pebble or twig more.

If i don't like them, I'll try another.

I did notice how much easier it is getting on my toes wirh the mistral plates on my indoor pair.

What is it about a long wheelbase plate that will keep you from falling over road debris?

My experience has been that when rolling over stuff in the road I want to be able to have my weight over my back wheels and in some cases lift up a bit on my front axle. A longer wheelbase plate would make that more difficult to do. I skate the same size plate inside and out.....so I know how it will react. I hope it works out for you. I just don't understand the logic behind it.

[Armadillo]

Originally Posted by Fancy-Kerrigan

What is it about a long wheelbase plate that will keep you from falling over road debris?

My experience has been that when rolling over stuff in the road I want to be able to have my weight over my back wheels and in some cases lift up a bit on my front axle. A longer wheelbase plate would make that more difficult to do. I skate the same size plate inside and out.....so I know how it will react. I hope it works out for you. I just don't understand the logic behind it.

Yes, taking weight off the front axle with body lean to rear helps, but as long as the mounting doesn't locate the rear axle way too far back to the rear end of the plate, then that should not be a hinderance for pushing weight down on heel, behind the rear axle in order to lift weight off off the front of the plate.

Think of a long wheelbase plate as a pry bar, and the front wheels as your hands on the end, trying to pry up your weight on the front end of the plate to go upward and over road debris or projecting surface imperfections.

The greater the wheelbase length, the greater the leverage the front axle/wheels to lift the front end upward and over stuff, with the back axle/wheels being the fulcrum against which front pries the weight of the skater upward.

Yes, if you lean back more on the rear axle, then the front axle/wheels don't need to be pried upward as hard since the rear lean lowers the weight on them.
However, the longer wheelbase also helps, especially if the length takes the front axle position further forward to help resist the braking effect and forward pitching that happenswhen front wheels stick on something.

The better a skater is outdoors with shifting their weight rearward on demand, the less they need to rely on the longer wheelbase and forward front axle as options to resist face plants.

-Armadillo

[Fancy-Kerrigan]

I disagree Dillo.
Skate plates are not like a pry bar and weight placement (front to back) is not about leaning.
Think of it this way....is it easier to pop a wheelie on a small BMX bike or a beach cruiser?
I'm choosing the shorter BMX, thank you very much.

Insert snarky skateboard mount comment (here).

[Armadillo]

Originally Posted by Fancy-Kerrigan

I disagree Dillo.
Skate plates are not like a pry bar and weight placement (front to back) is not about leaning.
Think of it this way....is it easier to pop a wheelie on a small BMX bike or a beach cruiser?
I'm choosing the shorter BMX, thank you very much.

Insert snarky skateboard mount comment (here).

No snarking here, just facts.
It is not the shorter v. longer length of bike frames or skate plates that matters most, it is how well the positioning of that length (under boot -OR- under bike seat/over pedals) allows for more of your weight to be directed more onto the rear axle, both on average, and when extra weight there is momentarily needed.

Pop a wheelie means shifting focus of your weight so that it ALL goes on the rear axle - AND BEYOND IT- and if you can get enough of your weight on the zone of a skate boot's heel that sticks out past the rear axle, a "wheelie" is much easier. Obviously a short wheelbase allows you to have that portion of the rearward protruding heel to go further past rear axle. This is the main reason why the Aussie style mount is so effective for keeping so much weight automatically onto the rear wheels and lowering the drag/breaking of the front wheels, which can still be way forward (with longer wheelbase)

ONLY at the front axle I am talking a pry bar or wedge effect with regard to any protrusions sticking up above the flat plane of the rolling surface and wedging themselves under the wheel effectively PRYING the wheel UPWARD as the front axle goes over them, also giving a braking effect according to their size, and to how much weight is focused on the front wheels, relative to the rear ones.

More % of your weight leaned onto the rear wheels as you roll outdoors means that when a LONGER wheelbase plate's front axle is "HIT" by bumps or objects, it can be more easily be lifted -- effectively pried up by bumps wedging under wheel, and the greater leverage of the longer wheelbase steals less momentum as front wheels are pried up and over the bumps, giving less resulting BREAKING resistance.

Keeping your rolling momentum outdoors demands that the amount of vertical lifting of your body weight from the rolling surface imperfections be kept to a minimum. Shorter plates tilt up more (angular lift) going over bumps, thus stealing more energy. Downhill skateboarders can go faster on longboards (than short boards) for this very same reason.

-Armadillo

[Mort]

The farther forward an axle is on your boot the more lift you will receive from a given input from your ankles. Depending on where the rear axle is will change the pressure you need to lift the front up. As Richard pointed out about the aussie style forward mount, it makes it much easier to lift the front of the skate because more of the heel is on the other side of the rear axle. Now skating backwards in that damn setup, I can only imagine how that can go horribly wrong very quickly over the wrong terrain or a unseen stick etc.

For skating outdoors its not so much a concern of how high you can lift the front axle by lifting your toes and rearwardly shifting your weight to the heels, its how much movement you get from an opposing force or object that attempts to bump into your front axle and trip you up.

My preference is as far forward as possible, and the rear to pivot directly under my heel, just as if my heel was on the ground. For this I ended up with a ridiculously long plate by most peoples standards. 193mm wheelbase on a size 10 vanilla freestyle. My feet are 283mm long. The total plate le gth on a size 12 arius is 280mm

[gotsk8s]

I have been trying to follow my wife outdoors now for the last 3 years and cannot keep up with her because she is way better at running over acorns, pebbles and squirrels than I am. That is due to a few things; her ability to skate very well and her plate length. If her plate was any longer (keeping the front axles in place and moving the rear further back) she would most assuredly fall, well maybe not fall but ...

If the rear axles are further back to just beyond the heels or even more you lose the ease of being able to lift the front of your skate to roll over those little obstacles that you encounter along the trails.

Here's a comparison: Long board skateboard down hill with drop through trucks vs a long board with a kick tail.

Another thing, Dillo, how would side surfing at 30+ mph downhill work out for ya with a skateboard mount? Or those heel spins? Not everyone skates like you I'm sure (thank goodness).

A properly placed/length plate can be loads of fun, not work, outside.

[Mort]

Yea, i wouldnt stick my rear axle past the natural pivot point of my heel either. But I would move the front of the plate forward, my skates have a slight lean forward when stood on end.

[gotsk8s]

Originally Posted by Mort

Yea, i wouldnt stick my rear axle past the natural pivot point of my heel either. But I would move the front of the plate forward, my skates have a slight lean forward when stood on end.

I kinda like to keep my indoors and outdoors close to the same so as to not have a lot of indifference between the 2 but I do understand where you're coming from.

[Mort]

Originally Posted by gotsk8s

I kinda like to keep my indoors and outdoors close to the same so as to not have a lot of indifference between the 2 but I do understand where you're coming from.

Lol, well mine is already maxed out pretty much. (They don't make a larger plate than the size 12. )Unless I went NTS, or flipped the plate backwards I couldn't get the front axle much farther forward.







You can kinda see the slight toe in I use when its laid sideways.

[Armadillo]

Originally Posted by gotsk8s

I have been trying to follow my wife outdoors now for the last 3 years and cannot keep up with her because she is way better at running over acorns, pebbles and squirrels than I am. That is due to a few things; her ability to skate very well and her plate length. If her plate was any longer (keeping the front axles in place and moving the rear further back) she would most assuredly fall, well maybe not fall but ...

If the rear axles are further back to just beyond the heels or even more you lose the ease of being able to lift the front of your skate to roll over those little obstacles that you encounter along the trails.

Here's a comparison: Long board skateboard down hill with drop through trucks vs a long board with a kick tail.

Another thing, Dillo, how would side surfing at 30+ mph downhill work out for ya with a skateboard mount? Or those heel spins? Not everyone skates like you I'm sure (thank goodness).

A properly placed/length plate can be loads of fun, not work, outside.

For one minute here, let's all just forget about rear axle locations, and efficiency at transferring more (or less) weight onto the rear wheels/axles, and how this helps to get the front wheels to go up and over the nasties coming at us as we roll outdoors.

Imagine just two identical statues fitted up on quads rolling down a slight uniform slope of medium rough asphalt. The laws of PHYSICS dictate that, if:

1) BOTH the front AND rear axles of both statues are carrying the same load and only their rear axles are at same locations;
2) The plates of one statue are longer giving a wheelbase that puts its front axles a full INCH further forward than the other statue (one inch shorter WB);
3) Then the statue with the longer wheelbase will ALWAYS roll faster down the slope, because the longer plate has better leverage for pushing the front wheels up, out of, over, and past any surface imperfections that the urethane drops down into as the front wheels roll.

Outdoors, quad plates rolling on rough surfaces are continuously rocking and bouncing up and down from the bumps and dips encountered.
With only two axles, the plate has NO OPTION but to rock, unlike inlines.

When a longer wheelbase plate gets rocked upward, from surface imperfections, it takes less WORK to be driven upward as it deals with transitioning over those imperfections.

This means the statue rolling on the longer WB plates will roll further & faster.
No "wheelies" are required in this scenario, but the principle of how & why longer wheelbase plates roll better, especially when the front axles are forward to the max, should be more clear. Momentum is more efficiently conserved, with vertically oscillating axles, by having a longer wheelbase plate.

I agree though that making your outdoor quad plate too excessively long toward the rear is going to hinder a skater's ability to make quick, rearward weight shifting adjustments when the front wheels are about to encounter something upward protruding, and when getting most of the load OFF the front axle(s) would help most for preventing a face plant.

-Armadillo

[Fancy-Kerrigan]

How long does one skate forward in one direction before they either:

A. have to make a turn

B. become bored of going in a straight line & decide to jam or art skate.

C. have to make extreme evasive maneuvers to avoid other humans or wildlife

A skateboard mount is not advantage in any of the above mentioned maneuvers.
But....if going in a straight line is your gig.....by all means rock out the obnoxiously long plate. I'm still going to make fun of you, no matter who you are

[Mort]

I can make pretty much any turn or maneuver that I have grip for, reguardless of wheelbase.

We all do just fine for all sorts of tight footwork, never a problem, well save for my wrist absolutely hate ground work. Its down right painful.

Evasive maneuvers are about being ready for anything, and most importantly your lateral agility, and ptecusion in footwork, not how well a plate turns..

The greater the skaters skill at footwork and lateral prowess, the less hinderance wheelbase or action angles are.

[gotsk8s]

Originally Posted by Mort

I can make pretty much any turn or maneuver that I have grip for, reguardless of wheelbase.

We all do just fine for all sorts of tight footwork, never a problem, well save for my wrist absolutely hate ground work. Its down right painful.

Evasive maneuvers are about being ready for anything, and most importantly your lateral agility, and ptecusion in footwork, not how well a plate turns..

The greater the skaters skill at footwork and lateral prowess, the less hinderance wheelbase or action angles are.

It's one of those"to each his/her own" deals but to express that it's THE way to go for EVERYONE is ludicrous. I think certain posters here can only skate one way and one way only and try to press that idea on to everyone as the be all end all of skating. He's a tard ....

[Mort]

Originally Posted by gotsk8s

It's one of those"to each his/her own" deals but to express that it's THE way to go for EVERYONE is ludicrous. I think certain posters here can only skate one way and one way only and try to press that idea on to everyone as the be all end all of skating. He's a tard ....

Yeh, it should be what ever makes you confident in your gear, no matter how stupid anyone else thinks it is. Once you develop a large skill base its time to expand again, new mounts, boots, plates, etc to further skills on various setups. Ya know, fiddle with stuff.

Learning to skate is the most important. Gear is nothing next to skill. But without the confidence to start with, most are lost and will give up.

Being on skates or some kind of skate like object most of my life, leaves me confident on pretty much anything. Had to use a LOT of hand me down crap as a kid (deplorable skate conditions Yo!).

I see valid points in everyones posts, but some get a little too crazy about things.


I carry a lot of boards at work and if I move my position on the board it effects the lift properties on the other end. So I totally see having the rear axle too far back can reduce effective toe up action. On my skates I have a harder time keeping my toes up while doing the grapevine on my heels, but on other skates its not as hard. Their rear axle placement increases lift potential in the front compared to my skates.

[Fancy-Kerrigan]

Placement of the front axle is just as important. Too far forward and cross overs and turns are more labor intensive. I also feel that I loose agility....I don't even know if that is the right word....but 3 turns and jam skating feel like I'm maneuvering skis.
I'm with my honey....to each his own. But I still make fun of him for skating some long a$$ plates
I love you honey <3

[Mort]

Originally Posted by Fancy-Kerrigan

Placement of the front axle is just as important. Too far forward and cross overs and turns are more labor intensive. I also feel that I loose agility....I don't even know if that is the right word....but 3 turns and jam skating feel like I'm maneuvering skis.
I'm with my honey....to each his own. But I still make fun of him for skating some long a$$ plates
I love you honey <3

Im sure when Im a bit less slow, to make up for aging, I might make a higher agility build since my body wont do the same ridiculousness forever. Have to make a MR2 instead of my longbed truck