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Inline Artistic Discussions about artistic skating on inline figure skates.

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Old August 20th, 2006, 04:52 PM   #1
CHC
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Default Flat or Elliptical Wheels for Artistic Inline Skating?

I have only just recently become more serious about artistic inline skating. I've only been skating properly for a couple of months but am steadily increasing my skills and trying to do one foot spins and single jumps (not much luck yet!). I am currently using 70mm 80A elliptical wheels (the same wheels used on recreational skates), but have seen special artistic wheels available. I've also seen people using flat wheels, like those on quad skates.

I'd love to know what people think about artistic wheels, and what people are using. Do they make a big difference? And is it easier/harder to obtain good edges/control/stability with flat wheels? What about spinning?

While I'm at it, any tips for achieving decent one foot spins?

Last edited by Kathie Fry; August 22nd, 2006 at 12:50 PM. Reason: expanded title
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Old September 8th, 2006, 07:33 PM   #2
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I've had better luck with a flat wheel similar to an agressive in-line wheel fo rdoing jumps and spins. The elliptical wheel works good for dance because you can get a deeper edge, but for freestyle, I don't need a great edge but I do like having a more stable surface for landing.
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Old September 22nd, 2006, 10:53 AM   #3
tguido56
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What brand of inline skates do you have (PIC, Snow White, ...) ?
What's you body weight?
What kind of surface are you skating on (wood, linoleum, quartz, cement) ?
All these elements affect wheel choice, as well as subjective preferences do.

Maybe you use PIC skates that comes with 4 wheels 70mm 80A.
If not, maybe you have three wheel skates. In this case each wheel supports more weight than in four wheel ones, so go for higher durometer.
Even the PICs - although being four wheeled - may need a higher hardness since they are rockered and only three wheels can simultaneously touch the ground.
Wheel hardness must be somehow correlated to body weight: more weight = higher hardness.

I've never seen flat wheels on artistic inline skates. Are you talking about aggro wheels? They are almost flat, very small diameter and high hardness (90A?). Don't think they're good for footwork. Tell us if not so.

As a rule of thumb hard wheels are more slippery on smooth and lacquered-like surfaces, such as wood and linoleum. Soft wheels allow deeper edges but are slower and gummy. You should go for a compromise.

Choose the bigger diameter that fits in the frame: 72mm should fit nicely, 76mm may not and you have to check in advance. Don't be worried if the clearance between the wheels is minimal: they spin regardless of that.

About the profile I got good results with hockey wheels or slalom-freestyle wheels. They are usually round or slightly elliptic. These wheels have a smaller hub compared to normal fitness or speed wheels and this seems to give better maneuvrability and edge control.

About models and brands
Hyper and Labeda are very good. Labeda Gripper and Labeda Shooters hockey wheels (marked medium or all-purpose, equivalento to 83A) were used by the italian athletes in the World Championship few years ago. Labeda changed its product line since then, but the brand in general is still good.
Hyper has a line of wheels marked +Grip. A truly non-slipping urethane with optimumm speed and long life. The Hyper Freedom Concrete+Grip comes in several diameters, hardness 84A, round profile, maybe available only on the European market. It is one of the wheels suggested by the G.R.I.P. artistic inline skating school in Paris - France. The Hyper Hyperformance+Grip is only 76mm and 80mm 83A, slightly elliptic and larger hub. The Hyper Pro 250 hockey wheel comes in 72mm and 76mm, 82A and 84A, round profile, a bit slower than the +Grips.

At the moment I use Hypers, an out-of-stock model: Power Edge hockey 84A. Very similar to the Freedom Concrete and Pro 250: same brand, same hub, same profile, same hardness. I use 72mm in front and 2 x 76mm for center and back wheels.
My technique is quite poor, so I cannot tell very much about spins and jumps.
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Old October 12th, 2006, 06:49 AM   #4
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I tried skating on some Triax inlines a few years ago. I discovered that I prefer quads I did try several different wheels and ended up with the power edge 72mm 86A wheels. I liked the harder wheels. On some Recreational skates I use indoors for fun I skate on 76mm indoor speed wheels. I found the speed wheels rolled much better then hockey wheels of the same size. I guess the speed wheels had more rebound and the hockey wheels were designed to hold up to hard skating.

I was looking at photos of WC Inline skaters and they seem to be on a variety of different wheels. Some prefered softer wheels that looked like hockey wheels in the 80A range. However a few of the top skaters, using 3 wheel skates, were rolling on semi rounded profile wheels and 88A or harder.

There aren't many inline Artistic wheels available. If I were to try inline again I would seriously consider "Resizing" some 76mm or 80mm / 90-95A indoor speed wheels on a lathe into 70mm - 72mm semi round wheels.

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Old October 12th, 2006, 11:13 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill View Post
I tried skating on some Triax inlines a few years ago. I discovered that I prefer quads I did try several different wheels and ended up with the power edge 72mm 86A wheels. I liked the harder wheels. On some Recreational skates I use indoors for fun I skate on 76mm indoor speed wheels. I found the speed wheels rolled much better then hockey wheels of the same size. I guess the speed wheels had more rebound and the hockey wheels were designed to hold up to hard skating.

I was looking at photos of WC Inline skaters and they seem to be on a variety of different wheels. Some prefered softer wheels that looked like hockey wheels in the 80A range. However a few of the top skaters, using 3 wheel skates, were rolling on semi rounded profile wheels and 88A or harder.

There aren't many inline Artistic wheels available. If I were to try inline again I would seriously consider "Resizing" some 76mm or 80mm / 90-95A indoor speed wheels on a lathe into 70mm - 72mm semi round wheels.

Bill
maybe Jayson being a world class inline single champion a few times can put his spin on this, plus he teaches and would have great insight with this subject.

Rick
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Old October 14th, 2006, 04:41 PM   #6
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maybe Jayson being a world class inline single champion a few times can put his spin on this, plus he teaches and would have great insight with this subject.

Rick
I sent an email to Jayson asking him that if and when he gets the chance to visit this conversation, that is opinon would be greatly appreciated.
I'd like to know as well
Liz
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Old October 15th, 2006, 04:19 PM   #7
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I sent an email to Jayson asking him that if and when he gets the chance to visit this conversation, that is opinon would be greatly appreciated.
I'd like to know as well
Liz
Hi Gang,

Jayson replied to my email. I wasn't really clear in the first email as to wether I was asking about Quads or Inlines (my bad), but I'll tell you what he said.

He's not exactly sure what his are called, but there is a photo of them on www.custominlines.com . It looks as though he may be on a flatter wheel.

For quads, he's always liked the Giotto 49 or 54d in the Panther or Musthang range. Now, I don't know if that is a width or hardness. Maybe one of you can decipher?

I was a little more specific in my follow-up to him. There seems to be another similar discussion going on as well. Maybe if he gets the chance he'll visit the forum

Skate on,
Liz
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Old October 15th, 2006, 10:35 PM   #8
rolaboi
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FLAT!!! for me there is no other option!! anyone who skates on the V1 has the flat wheel ... hence the ability to spin
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Old October 16th, 2006, 04:38 PM   #9
CHC
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Default Answers and more questions!

Hi everyone,

Thanks so much all your useful comments.

I was using PicSkates up until a couple of weeks ago. I changed to Snow Whites because I wasn't winning with one-foot spins and everyone seems to use the 3-wheel models. The PicSkates have elliptical wheels (72mm, 80A I think), but I'm using flatter wheels on my Snow Whites (68mm, 84A Pleasure Tool, which is what Greg Lane fits out on his V1 Custom Inlines). I've noticed two major things with the flatter wheels:

1. Really crap edges
- I guess a sacrifice for stability in freestyle
- I've also just been told that edges aren't that important in jumps/spins (though I do wonder how judges can distinguish jumps in that case e.g. flip vs lutz)

2. I can't seem to centre my 2 foot spin as well - it's like the wheels slip under me and I can't keep my feet in the one spot (they keep moving in until they're almost together and I can't balance)

I don't know if the latter is because of the higher durometer. Anyone have similar experiences/advice?

BTW, tguido56, the flat wheels I'm talking about aren't completely flat like aggro wheels. They have a curve, but very minimal. I think they are used by most artistic freestyle skaters (at least in Australia, I think).
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Old October 17th, 2006, 01:53 PM   #10
zerio
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Quote:
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Hi everyone,
- I've also just been told that edges aren't that important in jumps/spins (though I do wonder how judges can distinguish jumps in that case e.g. flip vs lutz).
Thanks for the wheels hints.. thou I must confess I am confused still...

As far as I could understand ... best choice are flatwheels..but they are not flat indeed...hardness is related to weright..( also to the type of surface)... but I know nothing about size...and there are so many models...and bearings...hubs,,, please... let us know good brand wheel for artistic skating..maybe the website and best dealers...would you please?

Thanks

Last edited by zerio; March 6th, 2007 at 10:43 PM.
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Old October 17th, 2006, 06:35 PM   #11
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The judges distiguish Lutz from Flip due to the direction you are skating to... Normaly a lutz is done when you jump skating clockwisely ( if you are not left handed) and a flip when you jump but you are skating unclockwisely... I guess you cannot tell anything about edges online skates just like in quad. Is that correct for you guys?

BTw, thanks for the wheels hints.. thou I must confess I am confused still...

As far as I could understand ... best choice are flatwheels..but they are not flat indeed...hardness is related to weright..( also to the type of surface)... but I know nothing about size...and there are so many models...and bearings...hubs,,, please... let us know good brand wheel for artistic skating..maybe the website and best dealers...would you please?

Thanks

Zecarlos
Rio
i think the flip and lutz you have wrong, it has nothing to do with direction of the jump, left or right but with the edge you take off of, the flip would be flat and usually is done straight up or across the floor, the lutz should be off an outer edge (although many dont) and usually done in the corner by either lefty or righty skaters.

sorry i dont know much about inlines but jayson can help you i am sure.

Rick
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Old October 17th, 2006, 06:46 PM   #12
zerio
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Yup Rick your right . If we were talking about ice it would be much easier to tell about edges...Ive already heard theres no real lutz on quads...due to the lack of edges... PLEASE, note that for me who has english as a second language is not easy to express myself clearly at all times and frequentely there are misunderstandings. So am re writting this posting.

IMHO , since we cannot state the edges easily the only way to ensure a lutz is would be to use the following trick: to skate clockwise( if you are not left handed) and to jump Lutz.( try it out).. as you can tell, in this circumstances when you take off you are obliged to use the outside edge, so, you can get it much easier . THEN you can move to the next level getting a straight line right after you skate clockwise and then the hardest level....any straight line..but definitely , the first choice is the easiest way to do the lutz... thou...it was a concept which Id learnt there in US when I took coach to Ron Sabo & World CH Michel Obrecht while in Rio...BTW, almost 30 years ...ONLY!!! .

BTW, theres a jump which has been sorta forggoten by most skaters...I dont even know how to spell it but its an axel which you land with your left foot... does any one recall the name??? Its pretty complicated and does not fit in most jump sequences..I believe its Bockel or school... Does anyone know what I am talking about?

Thanks.

Last edited by zerio; March 6th, 2007 at 10:43 PM.
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