S k a t e L o g     F o r u m
Inline Skating and Quad Roller Skating
Forum Hosts: Jessica Wright | Kathie Fry

FOLLOW US: Our Blog | Facebook | Twitter | Email    


Home - Forum Index - Africa Skating - Asia Skating - Europe Skating - Oceania Skating - Pan America Skating - Roller_Rinks - Friend the SkateLog Forum in Facebook - SkateLog Forum on Facebook

Forum Administrators: Jessica Wright and Kathie Fry | Email Us
Access code for buying and selling subforums: "skates"
How To Get a User Account and Posting Privileges in the SkateLog Forum
Use Google to Search the SkateLog Forum

Go Back   SkateLog Forum > Special Interest Skating Forums (sorted by number of posts) > Artistic Skating Forum
FAQ Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Artistic Skating Forum Discussions about any topic related to artistic roller skating including quad artistic skating, inline figure skating, pairs, dance, synchronized skating, and show skating.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old May 28th, 2014, 03:16 AM   #1
inverse137
www.sjsartistic.com
 
inverse137's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
Posts: 448
Default As a coach:

I'm not building a skater; I'm building a person.

The lessons I teach on the floor should be consistent with how I would want that kid to act throughout life.

I teach my kids skating. I teach them to shake the hand of their competition. I teach them to congratulate their competition even if they themselves choked. I teach them to introduce themselves at a meet. I teach them that they can learn from everyone whether it is another coach or a skater with less experience than them. I teach them that it is not about the medals but about being happy with how you skated (it's better to have an awesome skate and not even medal than to get a 1st place with no challenge.) I teach them to push themselves...no sandbagging. I teach them that it is OK to fall while learning...in fact, I tell them if they aren't falling they aren't pushing themselves. I teach them to be aggressive but not rude (hold their line but don't be that skater that intentionally tries to force the other person off of their line.) I interact with my skater as a person and not just, well, a skater. I check on how their homework is going and ask about their grades. I ask how things at school and home are.

Am I a national level coach? No. Will I teach my kid solid basics? Yes. Will I let my ego get in the way of my skater's progress? I hope not.

We are there for the skaters. It is not the other way around.

The best advice/saying someone told me about being a coach:

“A coach is someone who tells you what you don't want to hear, who has you see what you don't want to see, so you can be who you have always known you could be.”

This is not a business for me. I probably have a net loss for the year when I figure out my revenue from coaching.

Sorry for the rant. I just needed to get that off my chest. I've seen a lot of pettiness in skating lately and it is just taking away from the "fun." I don't mind hard work....but when it is no longer fun...well.....
inverse137 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 28th, 2014, 03:21 AM   #2
Sir Aaron
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 452
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by inverse137 View Post
I'm not building a skater; I'm building a person.

The lessons I teach on the floor should be consistent with how I would want that kid to act throughout life.

I teach my kids skating. I teach them to shake the hand of their competition. I teach them to congratulate their competition even if they themselves choked. I teach them to introduce themselves at a meet. I teach them that they can learn from everyone whether it is another coach or a skater with less experience than them. I teach them that it is not about the medals but about being happy with how you skated (it's better to have an awesome skate and not even medal than to get a 1st place with no challenge.) I teach them to push themselves...no sandbagging. I teach them that it is OK to fall while learning...in fact, I tell them if they aren't falling they aren't pushing themselves. I teach them to be aggressive but not rude (hold their line but don't be that skater that intentionally tries to force the other person off of their line.)

The best advice/saying someone told me about being a coach:

A coach is someone who tells you what you don't want to hear, who has you see what you don't want to see, so you can be who you have always known you could be.

This is not a business for me. I probably have a net loss for the year when I figure out my revenue from coaching.

Sorry for the rant. I just needed to get that off my chest. I've seen a lot of pettiness in skating lately and it is just taking away from the "fun." I don't mind hard work....but when it is no longer fun...well.....
LOL. You needed to get this off your chest before your surgery?

But I agree. Even though I'm new to the sport, I've noticed a certain pettiness from other competitors and within the sport in general.
Sir Aaron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 28th, 2014, 07:52 AM   #3
larryoracing
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Lomita, Ca, work in El Segundo, CA
Posts: 981
Smile Inverse137 good to hear your post. It's different.

I always felt the coaches job was to teach you something you didn't know how to do. Sad to say I'm a bad student. Hard headed and don't really like advice.

But I went skating last night and someone who I didn't even know tried to help me. I felt what he had to say had merit and it helped me. Practice makes perfect and you need to practice a lot to get good.

People in general are good coaches because they give you inspiration. I'm always amazed when people say I'm good or give me some good compliments. It helps you to continue on with your quest.

I'd really like to help some people but at present it's better to just watch and in the right time and place I might be able to give a suggestion or two. My advice is I don't like what I'm seeing. I hope I might be able to give a hand some day.

I always felt skating should be a sport and not a life style. Most people will never make a living off skating, so it should be more for fun than a way of life. Making money is where you got to keep your focus. It pays the bills and also the skating.

Larry O
larryoracing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 28th, 2014, 01:21 PM   #4
Molydomancer
Senior Member
 
Molydomancer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 367
Default

Inverse

As a skater parent, I want my kids' coach to be helping me and them to build their characters through their sport and I would hope the parents of your skaters are the same. You sound like a great coach and I hope the patrents appreciate that

My daughter has just won the Great Britain Cadet (under 15) solo dance championship but I am prouder of the way she and her rivals are great friends off the skating floor and compete with a spirit of fair play on it.

She really showed her mettle this weekend as we heard the sad news my sister had died TWO hours before my daughter had to compete. Naturally she was heart-broken about her aunt but managed to pull herself together and skate her best.

Moly
Molydomancer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 28th, 2014, 03:10 PM   #5
inverse137
www.sjsartistic.com
 
inverse137's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
Posts: 448
Default

Moly, sorry for your loss.

And congratulations to your daughter. She sounds like an outstanding person. And congratulations to you for raising her to be an outstanding person.
inverse137 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 28th, 2014, 03:38 PM   #6
Sir Aaron
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 452
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by larryoracing View Post
I always felt the coaches job was to teach you something you didn't know how to do. Sad to say I'm a bad student. Hard headed and don't really like advice.

But I went skating last night and someone who I didn't even know tried to help me. I felt what he had to say had merit and it helped me. Practice makes perfect and you need to practice a lot to get good.

People in general are good coaches because they give you inspiration. I'm always amazed when people say I'm good or give me some good compliments. It helps you to continue on with your quest.

I'd really like to help some people but at present it's better to just watch and in the right time and place I might be able to give a suggestion or two. My advice is I don't like what I'm seeing. I hope I might be able to give a hand some day.

I always felt skating should be a sport and not a life style. Most people will never make a living off skating, so it should be more for fun than a way of life. Making money is where you got to keep your focus. It pays the bills and also the skating.

Larry O
One thing you have to be careful of, is that if somebody already has a coach you might be inadvertently contradicting their coach.

As for me, I always listen respectfully to whatever advice somebody wants to give me. Then I try to ask questions so that the person knows I appreciate their advice even if later I decide it wasn't really what I needed. I realize most people offer advice because they are trying to be helpful and I don't want to discourage that attitude.
Sir Aaron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 28th, 2014, 07:13 PM   #7
inverse137
www.sjsartistic.com
 
inverse137's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
Posts: 448
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Aaron View Post
One thing you have to be careful of, is that if somebody already has a coach you might be inadvertently contradicting their coach.

As for me, I always listen respectfully to whatever advice somebody wants to give me. Then I try to ask questions so that the person knows I appreciate their advice even if later I decide it wasn't really what I needed. I realize most people offer advice because they are trying to be helpful and I don't want to discourage that attitude.
Yeah, I think you pretty much nailed it.
inverse137 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 28th, 2014, 08:02 PM   #8
larryoracing
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Lomita, Ca, work in El Segundo, CA
Posts: 981
Smile When do you take a stand on any issue in skating or not?

If you see a kid cheating his jumps and he has a teacher. Do you just stand there and say nothing because he has a teacher. I hope not, but that's what I see. Young skaters starting their careers on the wrong foot. It will affect their skating for the rest of their lives. Do they deserve that?

If you see something wrong in society when do you say no. This is wrong and its got to stop?

What you will find is most people will never stand up and say anything and that might even be a teacher who has a great responsibility in skating.

Skating declines, society declines.

It kind of reminds me of Sodom and Gamora. Not one person in the city had any idea of right or wrong. And they lived their lives accordingly. They were doing wrong for so long it became common practice. They looked the other way. God had to end it. I wonder about our skating industry and our society.

One thing is for certain. Skating is dying. I don't think it will ever come back. Not in my life time. Maybe yours. And our country may be on the wrong path. It may be its own destruction. Will we do anything? Probably not.
History has taught us when the leaders are corrupt, the people just follow along until it's end and become corrupt themselves. I think Germany was a good example. And history has taught us we never learn from our mistakes. History just keeps repeating itself over and over again, no matter how hard we try to stop it.


Larry O And happy skating, while it lasts.
larryoracing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 29th, 2014, 03:27 AM   #9
Sir Aaron
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 452
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by larryoracing View Post
If you see a kid cheating his jumps and he has a teacher. Do you just stand there and say nothing because he has a teacher. I hope not, but that's what I see. Young skaters starting their careers on the wrong foot. It will affect their skating for the rest of their lives. Do they deserve that?

If you see something wrong in society when do you say no. This is wrong and its got to stop?

What you will find is most people will never stand up and say anything and that might even be a teacher who has a great responsibility in skating.

Skating declines, society declines.

It kind of reminds me of Sodom and Gamora. Not one person in the city had any idea of right or wrong. And they lived their lives accordingly. They were doing wrong for so long it became common practice. They looked the other way. God had to end it. I wonder about our skating industry and our society.

One thing is for certain. Skating is dying. I don't think it will ever come back. Not in my life time. Maybe yours. And our country may be on the wrong path. It may be its own destruction. Will we do anything? Probably not.
History has taught us when the leaders are corrupt, the people just follow along until it's end and become corrupt themselves. I think Germany was a good example. And history has taught us we never learn from our mistakes. History just keeps repeating itself over and over again, no matter how hard we try to stop it.


Larry O And happy skating, while it lasts.
With regard to skating, the problem is that you may see a problem that needs correction but the coach may have them practicing it a certain way for a purpose. Sometimes it is to correct a worse problem initially then a correction will be made later.

And many coaches teach a "cheated jump" at beginner levels.

But I agree on your other points 200%.
Sir Aaron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 29th, 2014, 09:34 AM   #10
larryoracing
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Lomita, Ca, work in El Segundo, CA
Posts: 981
Talking Sir Aaron I really don't like commenting on a skater performance unless I have a

Solution.

I was watching a young skater practicing for her 1st freestyle test. I don't talk to most skaters, but they are grabbing my attention lately. At some point I will have to walk over to them and talk to them...LOL!

I see them dancing and I feel I could go over to them and say, how would you like to try that with a partner, because although it is not needed I grew up skating with a girl. It's what you are suppose to do in my mind...lol!


So, I saw this girl during session. I usually go three days a week and I see the same people practicing during session. I seldom see a pro helping these skaters. Once in a while I do but not very often. Why????? I can't answer that question.

When I grew up we had a minimum of 4 pros at any one time watching skaters during sessions. Sometimes 6. We had Jan and Keith, Sandy, Diane, Manuel and Larry.


So I was watching this skater practicing so hard in her jumps and spins. It's almost religious how dedicated she is. To me its really sad. She has no mentors, no pro and no role models, but she is practicing really hard for her first test. That is my guess watching her jumps and spins.

I figure she needs a better skate. How do you tell someone they have the wrong skate for her jumps? She needs an adjustable toestop that will reach down to the floor so she doesn't have this weird angle in her foot when she trys to toe pick to do a mapes jump....?She reaches down, very awkward angle and rotates on the toestop and does a mapes. Real Sad. This really kills me to no end. I feel like shooting myself. I can barely stand it.


Until I can figure out how to get her the right skates, I cannot comment on her jumps, but it bothers me to no end. When I started skating nobody cheated a jump at take off. The weak skater cheated the landing, but never deliberately the take off. Nobody ever spun on their toe stops. I know this skater knows no better. She just doesn't know.

Larry O
larryoracing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 29th, 2014, 10:30 AM   #11
rwsz
Senior Member
 
rwsz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: mass
Posts: 6,855
Default

Moly sorry for youi loss, my condolences to you and your family
__________________
Ciao Rick
rwsz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 29th, 2014, 10:32 AM   #12
rwsz
Senior Member
 
rwsz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: mass
Posts: 6,855
Default

Larry if there isnt a coach then i have no problem helping them or if they ask. but otherwise i wouldnt interfere with a coach even if they arent teaching the correct way. they are getting paid and you asking for confrontation if you do uninvited.

on the other hand if there isnt a coach there maybe you should start teaching and start a club. good luck
__________________
Ciao Rick
rwsz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 29th, 2014, 10:32 AM   #13
rwsz
Senior Member
 
rwsz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: mass
Posts: 6,855
Default

let me say also bad habits are formed and are very difficult to break. on the toe stop i dont see a problem with that intervention.
__________________
Ciao Rick
rwsz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 29th, 2014, 11:03 AM   #14
larryoracing
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Lomita, Ca, work in El Segundo, CA
Posts: 981
Smile Rick thanks for the advice. I will certainly take it.

I know this rink has one teacher. Slowly but surely I have seen more and more skaters, but they don't really practice and I know it is hard to practice during sessions. And what I have seen in general is very very basic. I haven't seen anybody do any hard dances or any jumps really. I think one person was trying to do a camel.

I did see one very good skater. He was an older gentleman trying to give me some hints on my OB upright spin. He looked like he was practicing some fancy International dances. But for some reason I don't think he is a teacher. I could be wrong. And he did not jump or do any spins. But he was a very strong dancer. I was impressed, even though I hate international dancing. I was taught American style.

I got a feeling this rink has a club, but for now I'm just trying to get into skating myself. My goal is to jump some day, do a routine and maybe enter a competition. In the mean time it doesn't hurt to try to relearn all the bronze and silver dances. That could take a year or two to perfect.

I got a feeling I could enter a few solo dance contests along the way.

sincerely,

Larry O
larryoracing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 29th, 2014, 11:22 AM   #15
Molydomancer
Senior Member
 
Molydomancer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 367
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Aaron View Post
One thing you have to be careful of, is that if somebody already has a coach you might be inadvertently contradicting their coach.

As for me, I always listen respectfully to whatever advice somebody wants to give me. Then I try to ask questions so that the person knows I appreciate their advice even if later I decide it wasn't really what I needed. I realize most people offer advice because they are trying to be helpful and I don't want to discourage that attitude.
I have always told my kids to listen if anyone wants to give them feedback on their skating but to check with their coach as soon as they can to see if he agrees. Often the points picked up on are what he is working with them on, but sometimes a fresh pair of eyes spot something new.
Molydomancer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 29th, 2014, 12:36 PM   #16
rwsz
Senior Member
 
rwsz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: mass
Posts: 6,855
Default

Larry if its just session then i dont see why not give out pointers. you also have to remember they are teaching a bit different today, they teach to do loops and salchows off of the toe stop instead of an edge and its done that way all around the country. they are now also trying to teach to close the mapes and toe walley jumps.

maybe you should ask about club and check it out to see what you think of it.
__________________
Ciao Rick
rwsz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 29th, 2014, 12:57 PM   #17
emtdpf
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 609
Default

Larry, what rink is this at?

When I give advise to new skaters, I always preface by saying that I am not a coach. and they should tell / ask their coach about what I'm going to tell them, during their lesson. then I give them tidbits......

I dont claim to know all, and I take lessons myself, so I can pass on what I know.

I am very selective to whom I talk also....example of this, we have this one older woman who attemps freestyle, I tried helping her once on a simple dance, and in her response, she said, "this is how they showed it on YOUTUBE"....ok, she doesnt take lessons from a coach, even though there is a very qualified coach at the rink. A few weeks later she came up to me and asked if she was improving....... I really had nothing to say, because.... no she was not improving.......so I just asked here if she felt like she was improving, she said yes, and I said, well... thats all that matters. we havnt talked since.....

many other stories to tell, but.......
emtdpf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 29th, 2014, 01:13 PM   #18
Derrick
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Northeastern Indiana
Posts: 1,345
Default Out here in fly over country there is no art skating

I'm trying get some art moves, but all I have is the internet. Two of my kids and I bought art skates and are trying. But we don't even know an art skater, let a lone a coach or pro. Not enough access to a rink either.

The youngest is 13, so he's late in starting. Pretty good session skater, but what can you do beyond that without a coach?

We haven't given up though, still trying. Keep posting video, thos are the best.
Derrick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 29th, 2014, 01:57 PM   #19
emtdpf
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 609
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Derrick View Post
I'm trying get some art moves, but all I have is the internet. Two of my kids and I bought art skates and are trying. But we don't even know an art skater, let a lone a coach or pro. Not enough access to a rink either.

The youngest is 13, so he's late in starting. Pretty good session skater, but what can you do beyond that without a coach?

We haven't given up though, still trying. Keep posting video, thos are the best.
lol... there is a club in Indiana, i have a friend who takes from there, and he has a partner in NY.....

Not sure where in Ind... but there is one.....
emtdpf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 29th, 2014, 02:50 PM   #20
Derrick
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Northeastern Indiana
Posts: 1,345
Default hmmm....

Quote:
Originally Posted by emtdpf View Post
lol... there is a club in Indiana, i have a friend who takes from there, and he has a partner in NY.....

Not sure where in Ind... but there is one.....
Did a little more checking. Perhaps that is skate-a-way in Plymouth,IN. About 1 hr from here. I think I'll go for a session this weekend. Their web site is pleasant, but vague.
Derrick is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 12:23 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.