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Ask DocSk8 (Expert Indoor Skate Building Advice) This forum is different then the other SkateLog forums in that it is not a discussion forum, but rather a place you can ask skate building expert Fred "DocSk8" Benjamin about building and repairing indoor speed, derby, and jamskate quad roller skates. Please start a new thread for each new question.

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Old May 18th, 2019, 09:26 AM   #1
zebra1922
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Default Wrong size plate?

Hey Doc (or anyone who can help!)

I think I’ve made a mistake with plate sizing and need some advice whether these plates will fit OK or I need a different size.

I’ve purchased some Pilot F-16 Falcon plates in size 7.00 to attach to a Riedell 120 boot size 11 (US). When I compare the Falcon to my current Thrust plate, the Falcon is about 2 cm shorter.

Now I can easily drill new holes, but do you think these plates will fit OK or will they cause me issues with skating (normal indoor rink skating, no derby, working on some rhythm and jam moves).





https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...9aa2e6_z_d.jpg
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Old May 19th, 2019, 06:31 AM   #2
Doc Sk8
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[QUOTE=zebra1922;737475]Hey Doc (or anyone who can help!)

I think Iíve made a mistake with plate sizing and need some advice whether these plates will fit OK or I need a different size.

Iíve purchased some Pilot F-16 Falcon plates in size 7.00 to attach to a Riedell 120 boot size 11 (US). When I compare the Falcon to my current Thrust plate, the Falcon is about 2 cm shorter.


The plate length is not real relevant, it is the wheel base that matters. Personally a 7" (179mm) plate will be fine, but ignore the old mounting hardware locations. You will need to reestablish the plate alignment and then drill new holes. Judging from the pic, you have the plate all the way to the back of the heel?? The key location is the front axles.


Now I can easily drill new holes, but do you think these plates will fit OK or will they cause me issues with skating (normal indoor rink skating, no derby, working on some rhythm and jam moves).




The only issue I can foresee is they won't sk8 like the old plates, but that should be a good thing.
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Old May 19th, 2019, 08:01 AM   #3
zebra1922
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Thanks Doc, appreciate the advice and reassurance Iíve not wasted a few quid (bucks!).

Iím not planning on mounting as per the pic, it was just to illustrate the plate size vs the skate. Yes that is with the plate mounted back on the heel, Iíll look to move forward under the ball - just waiting for some epoxy to fill the existing holes prior to redrilling.

Can you or anyone point me to the forum threads on centreing plates? I do not have a Snyder tool, Iíve read about 1st/2nd toe but donít know how to put this into practice.
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Old May 19th, 2019, 01:44 PM   #4
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Another way to mark the front center point is to put the boot on and find the point in between your second and third toe, then mark that spot.
Draw a line across those points, from
the heel to toe. Use this as a guide for the
centering of your plate. When you do mount your
plate, the front of the plate should not point to
the exact middle or apex of the front, but more
between the second and third toes.
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Old May 20th, 2019, 08:21 AM   #5
zebra1922
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ursle View Post
Another way to mark the front center point is to put the boot on and find the point in between your second and third toe, then mark that spot.
Draw a line across those points, from
the heel to toe. Use this as a guide for the
centering of your plate. When you do mount your
plate, the front of the plate should not point to
the exact middle or apex of the front, but more
between the second and third toes.
Thanks - I get the theory about the second/third toe, but when my foot is in the boot how exactly do I mark this accurately on the outside of the boot, I can't see my toes! It is one of those best guesses (and a couple of mm out makes no difference?) or is there some trick I'm not aware of?

Same goes for the ball of my foot. I can tell the general area but I'm not sure how accurate I can be marking the centre of the ball/point of pressure on the outside of the boot.
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Old May 20th, 2019, 12:38 PM   #6
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Take out the laces, a mm off won't matter.
The ball of the foot is a large area, I prefer to use the point between the big toe and the index toe, then choose an exact point of your foot and measure from it to the point between your big and index toes.
I prefer my front axle at the point between my big and index toes, a bit forward.
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Old May 20th, 2019, 02:08 PM   #7
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Great, thanks.

OK, I've done some measuring but now find I'm breaching one of the key rules I found through my research.

I've centrelines through the second to third toe. Based on this, for my right foot the wheels extend beyond the boot edge more on the right (outside) of the skate than the left (inside). Another rule I read was that wheels should extend equally beyond the boot edge.

Which is more important, this evenness or the 'true' centreline (assuming I've marked this correctly - looks like I have a big big toe so try centreline is quite markedly offset to the outside of the boot).
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Old May 20th, 2019, 03:46 PM   #8
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Viewed from above the wheels should be the same, so use tape for temporary placement and irreguardless of measurements, the wheels want to stick out the same on both sides, as seen from above.
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Old May 20th, 2019, 08:24 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ursle View Post
Viewed from above the wheels should be the same, so use tape for temporary placement and irreguardless of measurements, the wheels want to stick out the same on both sides, as seen from above.
So this means evenness of wheels trumps where the centreline of your foot may be? This probably makes sense as although second/third toe is the guide, I suppose this will differ widely between people depending on foot shape, toe spread etc but the centre of balance/weight will be broadly the same for all and more to the centre of the shoe? At least I assume that's the theory why equal balance in the wheels to the centre of the boot trumps a 'true' centreline.

Please tell me if this sounds or is a load of old rubbish and where I'm going wrong!

Current plan is to align the front axle pretty much under the ball of my foot, then centre from there. This will leave the centre around inside half of my second toe, and the heel axle around 2cm forward of what would be considered a 'normal' position (assuming normal places the plate towards the rear of the heel).

Its going to be interesting trying these out when I've got this done!
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Old May 20th, 2019, 08:50 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ursle View Post
Viewed from above the wheels should be the same, so use tape for temporary placement and irreguardless of measurements, the wheels want to stick out the same on both sides, as seen from above.

While most of the time this is fine, it is not always applicable. On occasion a boots sole is not centered up with the boot itself, and may be a 1/4 inch difference just from the few boots I've seen or could be as far as 5/16 to 3/8th in extreme cases.
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Old May 28th, 2019, 09:16 PM   #11
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Exclamation WTF??

Ursle is NOT Doc Sk8. If you are looking to follow his advice I suggest taking his "advice" w/ a pound of salt minimum. I certainly do not build sk8s the recommends.
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Old May 28th, 2019, 10:19 PM   #12
Mort
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Sk8 View Post
Ursle is NOT Doc Sk8. If you are looking to follow his advice I suggest taking his "advice" w/ a pound of salt minimum. I certainly do not build sk8s the recommends.
👏👏👏👏👏

This.

He is his name. " You are silly." No one addresses Mike Hagan as any kind of person to seek skate building advice for. Which is why jist about every time I read his posts the amount of ignorance makes me giggle at the things he goes on and on about while ignoring truths.

He just skates solo in a tennis/basketball court and has little to no idea how others even skate anymore.

Skatelogs #1 troll.
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Old May 28th, 2019, 10:19 PM   #13
zebra1922
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Sk8 View Post
Ursle is NOT Doc Sk8. If you are looking to follow his advice I suggest taking his "advice" w/ a pound of salt minimum. I certainly do not build sk8s the recommends.
So can I ask your recommendation both for centreline (how to find it at the front), and where you would recommend the front wheel to be located? I've got a draft set up with the front wheel just forward of the ball of my foot (given the slightly 'short' plate this ends up with the rear wheel just a little forward of my heel)? Do you forsee any problems with this?

I class myself as an intermediate skater. I like freestyle, currently working my way through the 3 turn repertoire and making my forward/backward/forward transitions nice and smooth. Onto spins soon (although I get really dizzy spinning) then maybe a jump or two.
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