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Outdoor Quads Discussions about outdoor quad skates and any discussion relatd to skating on quad roller skatse outdoors.

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Old March 18th, 2015, 12:45 AM   #1
pvasques
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Default Large wheels - best frame

Hi Guys!

For our new friends that enjoy outdoor skating can we come up witha list of frames that easily can receive wheels of 76mm or larger?
Is this an interesting topic?
Let's see....
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Old March 18th, 2015, 01:35 AM   #2
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Default

Good topic for sure.
Laser plates, including the Slider
Rannalli Rocket DA (blue) plates; not sure about the SA (black) ones - will check
SG Nova plates
SG Skins plates

Some steeper kingpin plates may have the deck height to fit the wheel, but their shallower action angle will swing the trucks on a more vertical arc, raising axles tips too much and hitting the wheel bite limit, unless the action is adjusted more toward all choked up setting (not so good).

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Old March 19th, 2015, 05:38 PM   #3
BigFoot
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Default Avanti plate

SG Avanti magnesium plate

The wheels are 76mm Zombie Hawgs. I use hard red cushions (93a), so to estimate the clearance on softer action, I loosened them and bent the axle over with my full weight. They still had 8mm of clearance.

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Old March 19th, 2015, 09:55 PM   #4
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I'm currently using Sure-Grip Avenger Mag with ABEC-11 FlyWheels 90mm 81a for training sesions. The cushions are Purple. They work very good.

Next month I'm planning to go to a 3 hours Skating Marathon in Spain with them. Before, I've been using the Kryptonics Classic K wheels in all sizes (76mm, 80mm and 85mm) with the same plate.





One friend, is using the Powerdyne Arius with Kryptonics Classic K 76mm. We'll test them with 80mm wheels in the future, but right now, I'm not sure if it's posible to use 80mm wheels in the Arius.

Regards,
Guille
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Old April 25th, 2015, 11:56 PM   #5
inkh0rn
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Default Cutting down wheels?

Hi Guille, read your blog on the P2P marathon with interest - thanks for posting.

I have a skate marathon coming up in North West England, it's on a 1 mile cycle track which is mostly very smooth. I've skated 26 laps in 2hrs 18 on 64mm Roll-Line Helium wheels (83A) last week, in training. I want to get this time down to nearer the 2 hour mark, I'm on Sure Grip Avengers too, with purple cushions.

With this in mind, I spent 70 on 8 SIMS Python longboard wheels - 72mm, 80A - thinking they would have a higher top speed and also handle rough road more smoothly. Unfortunately I've tested the SIMS wheels and found them to be SLOWER than the Heliums!

The SIMS wheels are very wide - 47mm contact patch - so I'm wondering if that might be why they are slower. Because, being almost 10mm bigger in diameter, they should be faster.

I see your ABEC 11 wheels have been cut down. Did you do this on a lathe, and did you round the edges of the wheels off? What is the contact patch of the wheels now?

I'm wondering whether it will be worth cutting the Pythons down (they could lose 10mm of the outer lip easily - the hub extends right across the wheel, too, which should give better roll) - or whether to sell them and get some different wheels. I wanted the Classic K in 76mm but the dealer (who is a longboarder) said they weren't known as a speed wheel, whereas the Pythons were really fast!

At this rate I'll probably end up doing the marathon on Heliums as they were faster...

I am 16 stone, that might have something to do with it!
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Old April 26th, 2015, 08:47 PM   #6
groldan
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Hi inkh0rn,

I got the ABEC-11 FlyWheels 90mm 81a in the 2N1 Skate Shoppe (Alaska), and they cut them down according to my wishes in their lathe. They are 30mm width, and about 25mm contact patch.

At the beginning they didn't work as expected, but after a few hundreds of kilometers they became to work very good. I guess I also needed some time to feel good with 90mm tall wheels.

Anyway, 30mm width (25mm contact patch) under some circunstances are not very good, for example when crossing. On the other hand, 47mm width wheels is maybe too width.

Comparing the same durometer between diferent manufacturers is sometimes a bit dificult, because they could be using a bit different urethane, and the feeling could not be the same. It also depends on the width, the hub size, weight, and so on. And also, different skaters have different opinions and experiences with the same wheels, so it's a bit subjetive.

I haven't any reference about the SIMS wheels.

If you are looking for a set of wheels, and because you are using Avengers, my suggestions (with my currect experience) are:
  • ABEC-11 FlyWheels 83mm 81a, cutting them down to make them SideSet (37mm width). You can also choose the 76mm FlyWheels.
  • Orangatang
    Kegel 80mm 80a, cutting them down to make them SideSet (43mm width). You can also get them in 83a durometer, but I also tested the 80a, and I guess are the best wheels I tested until now (last training session was at 25kmh average for 20km, which is a good average for me).
About the Kryptonics Classic K 76mm, I do believe the two options above are better for me. If you want Classic K, one friend bought them in Dr. Patin (Madrid) a couple of weeks ago. Here is the link: http://www.doctorpatin.com/tienda/ru...ssic-76mm-82a/

I have some Skating Marathons during the following weeks. I hope to reach 1h 45m for 42Km. Last year I started back to skate after 15 years without using my skates (well, maybe one time per year), and after the last 12 months training, I hope to improve 10 or 15 minutes. The first checkpoint will be in the Madrid Skating Marathon (June) where I will use the Orangatang Kegel and the second one will be the P2P 2015 (September) but I don't know which wheels I will use there yet. I run both of them last year, so I will be able to compare times (I used the Classic K 76mm and the Classic K 85mm last year).

About the Helius, one friend have the Helius and the Classic K 76mm, and he prefer the Classic K 76mm for sure. He's using PowerDyne Arius plate and Bones Ceramics bearings on a Riedell 265.

Regards,
Guille
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Old April 27th, 2015, 04:02 PM   #7
yedaki_de
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Default Orangatang Moronga

I have also good experience with the Orangatang Moronga 72mm 86a cut down to sideset. The contact patch is ca. 30mm. They are made of a very responsive PU, means good rebound.



The Heliums are also very fast, if your surface is smooth.

At the Berlinmarathon 2014 I used Abec11 BigZig 86a, original 75mm diameter, worn down to 72mm and cut to 36mm width.
My time was 1h 35min.



Warming up, I am on the left.
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Old April 27th, 2015, 04:07 PM   #8
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Orangatang wheels are awesome. I have used several sets on my longboard.

For outdoor quad skating, I'd run the 73mm The Cage wheels or 76mm Durian wheels in purple 83a durometer.
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Old April 28th, 2015, 12:29 AM   #9
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by inkh0rn View Post
Hi Guille, read your blog on the P2P marathon with interest - thanks for posting.

I have a skate marathon coming up in North West England, it's on a 1 mile cycle track which is mostly very smooth. I've skated 26 laps in 2hrs 18 on 64mm Roll-Line Helium wheels (83A) last week, in training. I want to get this time down to nearer the 2 hour mark, I'm on Sure Grip Avengers too, with purple cushions.

With this in mind, I spent 70 on 8 SIMS Python longboard wheels - 72mm, 80A - thinking they would have a higher top speed and also handle rough road more smoothly. Unfortunately I've tested the SIMS wheels and found them to be SLOWER than the Heliums!

The SIMS wheels are very wide - 47mm contact patch - so I'm wondering if that might be why they are slower. Because, being almost 10mm bigger in diameter, they should be faster.

I see your ABEC 11 wheels have been cut down. Did you do this on a lathe, and did you round the edges of the wheels off? What is the contact patch of the wheels now?

I'm wondering whether it will be worth cutting the Pythons down (they could lose 10mm of the outer lip easily - the hub extends right across the wheel, too, which should give better roll) - or whether to sell them and get some different wheels. I wanted the Classic K in 76mm but the dealer (who is a longboarder) said they weren't known as a speed wheel, whereas the Pythons were really fast!

At this rate I'll probably end up doing the marathon on Heliums as they were faster...

I am 16 stone, that might have something to do with it!
Assuming the Python wheel urethane is really as good for speed as the skate shop told you, I suggest they are slow from the too wide contact patch.
IMO, the ideal contact patch width is between 28-34mm depending on skater weight and wheel diameter.

The helium wheels have a much narrower contact patch. They also have a much thinner urethane layer from their nicely oversize 49mm hub diameter.
IMO, there is a certain thickness of urethane layer that gives best roll, depending on the urethane formula and firmness, resulting in variations of the % of squish that takes place with every revolution. Too much or too little urethane squish will reduce the peak potential rebound performance.

Too wide a contact patch is a major speed killer. Too narrow a contact patch kills grip and limits peak power of the push stroke.

Too heavy wheels limit your stoke cadence and wears you out early in longer races. Combining a too wide contact patch with a too small hub in a larger size (72-90mm) quad wheel is the kiss of death for leg speed and cadence, and kills roll from the excess wheel width snow plow effect.

This is why I prefer my larger wheels to always have the biggest available hubs, in order to avoid having the much too thick layers of urethane adding so much weight that the optimum push stroke cadence cannot be maintained
throughout the longer races.

I also think that after you go past around 70-72mm wheel diameter, the amount of speed improvement to be gained from even larger diameters drops off rapidly. Other factors like hub size, urethane formula, narrower contact patch, and lower wheel weight can begin to have a greater impact on speed improvement. Only when the asphalt roughness is most severe does going up to to the 76mm and beyond wheel diameters still seem give some measurable improvements.

-Armadillo
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