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Ask DocSk8 (Expert Indoor Skate Building Advice) This forum is different then the other SkateLog forums in that it is not a discussion forum, but rather a place you can ask skate building expert Fred "DocSk8" Benjamin about building and repairing indoor speed, derby, and jamskate quad roller skates. Please start a new thread for each new question.

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Old February 11th, 2020, 08:23 PM   #1
FlailingLlama
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Default What is the exact size of the balls in Bones Super Swiss 6 bearings?

Hello,

I already asked rollerbones if they'd be making a ceramic version of the ss6, and they said no, so I figured I'd just buy the SS6, and the balls separately, and make my own. Seems I can get 100 Si3N4 balls for around 20-30 dollars. Would you happen to know the dimensions? I read online it was 3/16, but I thought maybe it was not exactly that size.

Thank you

Last edited by FlailingLlama; February 11th, 2020 at 09:24 PM. Reason: Just saw the "start a new thread for every question" rule
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Old February 12th, 2020, 01:09 AM   #2
ursle
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Default What is the exact size of the balls in Bones Super Swiss 6 bearings?

Super Swiss come with 6, 3/16 inch balls instead of 7, 5/32 inch balls used in most 608 bearings. Thus, the SS6 balls are 20% larger and roll fewer times to go the same distance.

Wait, I started a new thread in the general forum for this question, like the other question by this op, twice, the forum seems designed to disregard directions, anyway, I would NEVER post in this private but not password protected special forum, but anyway, 6 3/16th's
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Old February 14th, 2020, 07:34 PM   #3
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Default So ursle thinks he is Doc Sk8??

Quote:
Originally Posted by ursle View Post
Super Swiss come with 6, 3/16 inch balls instead of 7, 5/32 inch balls used in most 608 bearings. Thus, the SS6 balls are 20% larger and roll fewer times to go the same distance.

Wait, I started a new thread in the general forum for this question, like the other question by this op, twice, the forum seems designed to disregard directions, anyway, I would NEVER post in this private but not password protected special forum, but anyway, 6 3/16th's
Gee how polite of you ursle. So yeah, 3/16 (4.765mm) makes real good sense for a dimension on a metric bearing.... Here is a thought, buy a set, tear them down and mic ALL the balls. Let me know what ya find out.. Since they only come in 8mm, I ain't interested in playing with them.
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Old February 15th, 2020, 04:17 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doc Sk8 View Post
Gee how polite of you ursle. So yeah, 3/16 (4.765mm) makes real good sense for a dimension on a metric bearing.... Here is a thought, buy a set, tear them down and mic ALL the balls. Let me know what ya find out.. Since they only come in 8mm, I ain't interested in playing with them.
Will do, I purchased a single Swiss 6, and a single ceramic swiss, I'll be checking dimensions and channel width and such things.

I already purchased 5/32 silicone nitride balls for my 7 ball bearings, and replaced the balls in 15 out of 17 bearings I tried. I believe I damaged the races in the two I couldn't replace, because I couldn't even get the original steel balls back into those races.

Did some basic coast down tests at the closest rink to me, zero difference. (on the ceramic balls) also tried Nano-Lube on freshly re-cleaned bearings, zero difference for coast down.

I figured ceramic balls should help some aspect, or at least feel different, but nope, identical in feel/smoothness, everything.

I have read that they last longer than steel balls, so longevity might have been increased, but I've also seen durability tests where a high quality steel ball drastically outperforms ceramics.
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Old February 15th, 2020, 09:45 PM   #5
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Default Interesting.

My observations have shown over time the ceramic balls hold up longer since they surface is harder to damage. This means that the damage typically found on the balls is not transferred to the races, so the bearing certainly "should" last longer.

Anyway, my comment about measuring the balls still stands but it will require a very good (as in expensive) lab grade digital micrometer. I am curious to find our how much variability there is between the ball diameters in each bearing.
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Old February 16th, 2020, 01:01 AM   #6
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My dad used to be a machinist, so we have some fairly precise inside and outside calipers and radius finding tools.

The calipers measure to the 0.0000in, so hopefully that is enough.
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Old February 17th, 2020, 05:05 PM   #7
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Ordered a single bearing of Bones Super Swiss 6 and Bones Swiss Ceramic...

Internal inspection observations...

Super Swiss 6
-Noticed the balls are very slightly loose in the race, felt as a stuttering vibration when spinning the bearing by hand.
-ball retainer/cage took a little more effort to push off than i'm used to
-Has extra channel machined into outer race to seat shield
-MUCH wider, deeper, and glossier outer race channel for the bigger balls. (compared to the Abec 5's from Sure Grip, and Moto Deluxe I've opened)
-No unmachined or unpolished surfaces
-inner race channel width is TWICE the width of 7 ball bearings I've opened, including the Bones swiss ceramics

Swiss Ceramic
-ball retainer took EXTREME pressure to remove, VERY tightly cradles the balls (pun)
-glossy inner and outer race channels
-seems to be some dark coating on the material next to the outer race channel. the ss6 doesn't have this


Ball Dimensions in inches...

Super Swiss 6 Steel Balls (WIB Bearings) (new)
-0.1872
-0.1872
-0.1872
-0.1872
-0.1872
-0.1872

Swiss Ceramic Balls (grade 5 Silicon Nitride from WIB Bearings) (new)
-0.1561
-0.1561
-0.1561
-0.1561
-0.1561
-0.1561
-0.1561

grade 5 5/32" silicon nitride balls from BC Precision (new)
-0.1561
-0.1561
-0.1561
-0.1561
-0.1561
-0.1561
-0.1561

Steel balls from Moto Deluxe Bearing (15 hours of skate practice on these balls)
-0.1569
-0.1561
-0.1565
-0.1562
-0.1561
-0.1561
-0.1562

Steel ball from Sure Grip Fame Skates Abec 5 (30 hours of skating)
-0.1558
-0.1558
-0.1557
-0.1558
-0.1558
-0.1557
-0.1558

Last edited by FlailingLlama; February 18th, 2020 at 06:27 PM.
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Old February 17th, 2020, 06:18 PM   #8
Mort
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If a retainer takes a lot of pressure to remove, that's actually a good thing.

Retainers that fit loosely can come off the balls and then the bearing comes apart once all the balls end up on one side.

The inertia from a skater going from forwards to backwards can yank a loose fitting retainer off under the right conditions.
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Old February 18th, 2020, 06:03 PM   #9
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Updated with measurements.

Interesting how minimal time skating on the steel balls seems to wear them down. I mean, it makes sense. I also clean and oil my bearings regularly.

I wonder if the tolerances opening up over time, but not enough for the balls to fall off the race, is a good thing?

There is a skater at one of the rinks I go to, with Fafnir 8 balls he purchased brand new in 1985, and has been skating on them the entire time. I wonder if he would let me take apart one of them to measure the balls.

I also haven't opened up any 8 ball bearings, but I'm assuming the race channels are even more shallow, than the 7 ball. Well, maybe not, if they are using 8 of the same size as 7.
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Old February 19th, 2020, 08:20 PM   #10
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Default How much??

How much wear have you seen?? I mean, they will wear. Steel on steel, even w/ lube is gonna wear.


Interesting variability measurements. That Moto is kind of scary.. Never been impressed w/ those.


The looseness is the radial clearance. The really good no $hit sk8 bearings have a decent amount. The old 8 ball Fafnirs were C7s. Loose like a Bones / Boss Swiss.
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