Beginner with a wheel wear question

gearhead82 · June 17th, 2009, 07:40 PM

Hi,

This is my first post to the forums. I bought a pair of K2 Moto 90s about 2 months ago and had never skated prior. I started skating as just another way to get/stay in shape and I've worked my way up to skating an 8.5 mile loop on the local bike path a few days/week at a 11-12mph average (per Garmin Edge 305). I'm a 26 year old male, 6' tall, 240lbs, 16% bodyfat in pretty good shape.

This is a picture of my right-front wheel after only 17 miles. The left-front looks similar. I've read a couple "tutorials" that I've found online about correcting a toe push but obviously I'm not having much luck. The rest of my wheels show minimal and even wear so I'm not pronating badly based on looking at the back 3 wheels. I noticed that with my weight the 82a wheels that came with the skates were wearing rather quickly so I replaced them with these cheapo 89a Hyper "Agent Orange" wheels. They're definitely not wearing as quickly as the originals but I have to rotate them after almost every skate. Any advice or ideas are welcome. I've studied dozens of youtube videos and can't figure out what I'm doing wrong. Also, I'm in Columbus Ohio so if anyone knows a good place to take a lesson around here, that would be great.

Thanks,
Brandon

skaterdog · June 17th, 2009, 10:10 PM

To me when you are new to skating and weigh 240 (which I did when I started) you want a wheel that's going to be a workhorse. I used to skate on the Hyper Mach IIs and could put well over 1,000 miles on a set.

The toe flick thing is a work in progress. I still struggle with that from time to time judging by my wheels. So work on the tutorials or someone like Speedy can jump into this thread and guide you through the toe flick dilemma but to me that is a tough nut to crack.

First I'd start with some workhorse wheels so you can put some miles in refining your technique.

2old2sk8t · June 17th, 2009, 11:40 PM

Brandon,

I am no expert by any stretch, but I have to conclude that you are leaning too far forward, thereby putting excess weight (hence more friction) to the front wheels. You want to get into a position where more of your weight is shifted to the back wheels particularly when you push and extend your leg. That's where you get the real power. That body position is probably also contributing to the very evident pronation as judged from the inside wheel wear. I think it would be hard to involve more of the outside edge if you are leaning too far forward.

Here's an article that may help you. http://inlineottawa.com/content/tips...ayskate_06.php

The salient point ....

"In basic position the joints should be balanced so that the body weight and centre of gravity are positioned over the skate roughly 2/3 of the way towards the heel. Most skaters demonstrate two related problems with this: insufficient knee bend, and too much forward flexion of the trunk. In such a position the centre of gravity falls over the toe wheel, or even worse – ahead of the skate entirely. This causes a chain reaction of problems. The skater will have a tendency to push back, wear out their front wheel, get a sore back, and reduce overall efficiency. To correct for these errors the strategy is normally to bend the knees further and elevate the trunk. This moves the centre of gravity more rearward where body weight is evenly distributed over all wheels."

Good luck.

Criss · June 18th, 2009, 06:23 AM

try skating with a rockered setup since there's no contact with the front wheels on the ground , hope you can learn more easily

Curious Cat · June 18th, 2009, 08:52 AM

^^ I dont see how that will help correct poor technique. You can still toe flick rockered skates. I see noob hockey players do it all the time, as well as pushing out the back, being too far on their toes etc.

A ex-speed skater buddy of mine used to have me skate with my hands behind my back. It would help with my stride, because if I pushed backwards rather than sideways, I would feel off balance.

Kneed bend is very important too. I notice people who push out the back also tend to be more upright. It reminds me of ice figure skaters (more upright and pushing out the back), as opposed to a hockey player or speed skater who are bent over and pushing to the sides (speed skaters are more crouched than hockey players).

gearhead82 · June 18th, 2009, 01:54 PM

Thank you all for the replies.

I have noticed that I put a lot of my weight on the front wheels. When I consciously try to move my weight towards the back, I feel very unstable. I will work on keeping my knees bent a little more and bending forward less. Quote from that article posted by 2old2sk8t sounds exactly like what's happening to me.

Thanks again!

Armadillo · June 18th, 2009, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gearhead82

Thank you all for the replies.

I have noticed that I put a lot of my weight on the front wheels. When I consciously try to move my weight towards the back, I feel very unstable. I will work on keeping my knees bent a little more and bending forward less. Quote from that article posted by 2old2sk8t sounds exactly like what's happening to me.

Thanks again!

I suggest that a good way to better distribute your weight is to mentally concentrate on FEELING the vibrations coming up from all the wheels. The goal is to feel the rear wheel vibration at same level as front. By this approach you don't focus on you weight, but rather on what you feel from the wheels. If less weight is on rear wheels, you won't feel much from them, so by just trying to feel them better, your weight shifts without thinking about weight shifting.

You will find that if your weight is evenly distributed over all the wheels, you will also have noticeably better roll.

-Armadillo

Wolfgang · June 18th, 2009, 03:02 PM

Asphalt is hard.
Much harder than any wheel.
17 miles isn't all that much, but if the front wheel is the only one showing this wear, you're definitely taking that 'toe push' way too seriously.
Push with the entire edge instead.
And take the foot just a little beyond the midline, so that when you push again, you're actually pushing with the outer edge of the wheels first.
That should help even out wear.

SmileySk8s · June 19th, 2009, 03:09 AM

I agree that you might be leaning too far forward, bending at the waist instead of squatting (like you're going to sit on the john- as some fellow skaters have suggested). You really do feel a difference when you get low and squat. You can put your hands on your knees or together above your knees for starters while you get your balance. Lower center of gravity will help feel more stable. Think nose-knees-toes. And concentrate on the sideways push instead of back and "heel dig" instead of the toe push. By heel dig for me it feels like I am keeping my skate more level with the ground instead of dropping my ankle at the end of the stroke which caused my toe pushing and subsequent drag on the pavement. I was also told to focus on the push forward and glide, and when I bring my skate forward placing it next to the gliding skate to knee touch.... hard to explain. I'm a newbie after all.. I can feel myself striding forward more on the gliding leg and pushing to the side than pushing back, and in a slower gait. So I use less effort yet maintain the same speed. And going uphill is easier with the heel and sitting back on my squat, but not so much that I fall backward.

Check out this site for more info...
http://www.inlineplanet.com/08/03/begg-toe-push.html

gearhead82 · June 20th, 2009, 11:30 PM

Update:

I've skated twice after having read the replies here and an article or two. Been keeping my knees bent more and I'm getting much more comfortable keeping my weight towards the rear. I'm definitely using a completely different set of muscles and having to re-train myself. I can maintain good technique for short distances and have to kind of stand up a little now and then. I can feel that I have much more power and I'm no longer tearing up that front wheel. Thanks!

June 17th, 2009, 07:40 PM	#1
gearhead82 Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 3	Beginner with a wheel wear question Hi, This is my first post to the forums. I bought a pair of K2 Moto 90s about 2 months ago and had never skated prior. I started skating as just another way to get/stay in shape and I've worked my way up to skating an 8.5 mile loop on the local bike path a few days/week at a 11-12mph average (per Garmin Edge 305). I'm a 26 year old male, 6' tall, 240lbs, 16% bodyfat in pretty good shape. This is a picture of my right-front wheel after only 17 miles. The left-front looks similar. I've read a couple "tutorials" that I've found online about correcting a toe push but obviously I'm not having much luck. The rest of my wheels show minimal and even wear so I'm not pronating badly based on looking at the back 3 wheels. I noticed that with my weight the 82a wheels that came with the skates were wearing rather quickly so I replaced them with these cheapo 89a Hyper "Agent Orange" wheels. They're definitely not wearing as quickly as the originals but I have to rotate them after almost every skate. Any advice or ideas are welcome. I've studied dozens of youtube videos and can't figure out what I'm doing wrong. Also, I'm in Columbus Ohio so if anyone knows a good place to take a lesson around here, that would be great. Thanks, Brandon

June 18th, 2009, 06:23 AM	#4
Criss Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 40	try skating with a rockered setup since there's no contact with the front wheels on the ground , hope you can learn more easily __________________ volting... location : Singapore skating status : slalom level 3 updated : 09 - 09 - 09 =D

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June 17th, 2009, 10:10 PM	#2
skaterdog Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 1,755	To me when you are new to skating and weigh 240 (which I did when I started) you want a wheel that's going to be a workhorse. I used to skate on the Hyper Mach IIs and could put well over 1,000 miles on a set. The toe flick thing is a work in progress. I still struggle with that from time to time judging by my wheels. So work on the tutorials or someone like Speedy can jump into this thread and guide you through the toe flick dilemma but to me that is a tough nut to crack. First I'd start with some workhorse wheels so you can put some miles in refining your technique.

June 17th, 2009, 11:40 PM	#3
2old2sk8t Senior Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Long Island, NY Posts: 176	Brandon, I am no expert by any stretch, but I have to conclude that you are leaning too far forward, thereby putting excess weight (hence more friction) to the front wheels. You want to get into a position where more of your weight is shifted to the back wheels particularly when you push and extend your leg. That's where you get the real power. That body position is probably also contributing to the very evident pronation as judged from the inside wheel wear. I think it would be hard to involve more of the outside edge if you are leaning too far forward. Here's an article that may help you. http://inlineottawa.com/content/tips...ayskate_06.php The salient point .... "In basic position the joints should be balanced so that the body weight and centre of gravity are positioned over the skate roughly 2/3 of the way towards the heel. Most skaters demonstrate two related problems with this: insufficient knee bend, and too much forward flexion of the trunk. In such a position the centre of gravity falls over the toe wheel, or even worse – ahead of the skate entirely. This causes a chain reaction of problems. The skater will have a tendency to push back, wear out their front wheel, get a sore back, and reduce overall efficiency. To correct for these errors the strategy is normally to bend the knees further and elevate the trunk. This moves the centre of gravity more rearward where body weight is evenly distributed over all wheels." Good luck.

June 18th, 2009, 08:52 AM	#5
Curious Cat Hockey Nut Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 199	^^ I dont see how that will help correct poor technique. You can still toe flick rockered skates. I see noob hockey players do it all the time, as well as pushing out the back, being too far on their toes etc. A ex-speed skater buddy of mine used to have me skate with my hands behind my back. It would help with my stride, because if I pushed backwards rather than sideways, I would feel off balance. Kneed bend is very important too. I notice people who push out the back also tend to be more upright. It reminds me of ice figure skaters (more upright and pushing out the back), as opposed to a hockey player or speed skater who are bent over and pushing to the sides (speed skaters are more crouched than hockey players).

June 18th, 2009, 01:54 PM	#6
gearhead82 Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 3	Thank you all for the replies. I have noticed that I put a lot of my weight on the front wheels. When I consciously try to move my weight towards the back, I feel very unstable. I will work on keeping my knees bent a little more and bending forward less. Quote from that article posted by 2old2sk8t sounds exactly like what's happening to me. Thanks again!

June 18th, 2009, 03:02 PM	#8
Wolfgang Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 370	Asphalt is hard. Much harder than any wheel. 17 miles isn't all that much, but if the front wheel is the only one showing this wear, you're definitely taking that 'toe push' way too seriously. Push with the entire edge instead. And take the foot just a little beyond the midline, so that when you push again, you're actually pushing with the outer edge of the wheels first. That should help even out wear.

June 19th, 2009, 03:09 AM	#9
SmileySk8s Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Chicago IL Posts: 310	I agree that you might be leaning too far forward, bending at the waist instead of squatting (like you're going to sit on the john- as some fellow skaters have suggested). You really do feel a difference when you get low and squat. You can put your hands on your knees or together above your knees for starters while you get your balance. Lower center of gravity will help feel more stable. Think nose-knees-toes. And concentrate on the sideways push instead of back and "heel dig" instead of the toe push. By heel dig for me it feels like I am keeping my skate more level with the ground instead of dropping my ankle at the end of the stroke which caused my toe pushing and subsequent drag on the pavement. I was also told to focus on the push forward and glide, and when I bring my skate forward placing it next to the gliding skate to knee touch.... hard to explain. I'm a newbie after all.. I can feel myself striding forward more on the gliding leg and pushing to the side than pushing back, and in a slower gait. So I use less effort yet maintain the same speed. And going uphill is easier with the heel and sitting back on my squat, but not so much that I fall backward. Check out this site for more info... http://www.inlineplanet.com/08/03/begg-toe-push.html

June 20th, 2009, 11:30 PM	#10
gearhead82 Junior Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 3	Update: I've skated twice after having read the replies here and an article or two. Been keeping my knees bent more and I'm getting much more comfortable keeping my weight towards the rear. I'm definitely using a completely different set of muscles and having to re-train myself. I can maintain good technique for short distances and have to kind of stand up a little now and then. I can feel that I have much more power and I'm no longer tearing up that front wheel. Thanks!