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Old December 23rd, 2009, 06:09 PM   #1
khail71
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Default mandatory toes stops?

I've been skating (quads) for over 29 years. I've never been to a rink where I had to have toestops or I wouldn't be allowed to roll. But, after reading through several different threads on this forum, I know these places exist.

I stopped wearing toestops when I was about 11-12 years old, and put in (fomac) toeplugs instead. I do not need or desire toestops for any reason. At the rink I grew up in, you didn't have to have toestops, but if you didn't, you had to have something plugging the hole so you didn't scratch/chip/groove/damage the roller skating surface. That always made perfect sense to me.

But what doesn't make sense to me is..... why you can't wear a pair of skates with NTS plates at some rinks? There is no exposed metal or nylon to damage the floor or injure a fellow skater during an accident. It just doesn't make sense to me.

It's as if management is saying: "You are only allowed to stop with toestops. This is how we want you to skate. These are the only skate products you can bring in." ......seems fairly discriminatory to me!!!!

It's really a shame too, wouldn't they lose business from the experienced/advanced skaters that don't need a piece of rubber (or whatever the toestop is made of) on their skates to stop?

I find it arrogant on managements behalf to recquire such gear.....
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Old December 23rd, 2009, 09:29 PM   #2
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Hi khail71,

In the over 160 Rinks across the USA, that I've skated in over the last 57 yrs, I've only been in a few that had issues with the lack of toe-stops. This has always been in relation to skate plates that had a place for stops - but the wear'ers had no stops or plugs in place, to prevent damage to the floors. Sooo, they were required to put in one, or the other, to skate at the Rink.

A very rational thing to do IMO, and I should think all Rinks would do it to protect their floors.

I've never seen anyone question the use of NTS plates.

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Old December 24th, 2009, 05:54 AM   #3
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i read in another thread (which i have been unable to find again) that someone with NTS plates couldn't skate them in a certain rink, because they had no toe stop. yes, i would agree that a plug or a stop is necessary, but i wouldn't agree with not allowing a NTS skate on the floor.
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Old December 24th, 2009, 01:04 PM   #4
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Around Washington DC, the rinks are downright terrible. One rink requires only toe plug, and they actively enforce this. They literally pulled my girlfriend and I off the floor to inspect our toe plugs because the girl at the entrance thought we were trying to sneak in without plugs. We both had them in, but they were hard to see apparently.

The second closest rink doesn't care if you don't have toe plugs. BUT, if you have a toe plug or stopper that is black, it MUST be removed before they allow you to skate. Any other color is fine in plugs or stops. Yeesh. Sometimes we forget and we end up at a rink trying to take them out or put them in..a PITA.
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Old December 24th, 2009, 06:11 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khail71 View Post
i read in another thread (which i have been unable to find again) that someone with NTS plates couldn't skate them in a certain rink, because they had no toe stop. yes, i would agree that a plug or a stop is necessary, but i wouldn't agree with not allowing a NTS skate on the floor.
It's a reasonably safe bet that that story involved an employee doing his or her best to enforce the letter of their boss' rule, and not the spirit. It's fairly probable that the employee didn't know WHY toe stops or plugs were required, just that they were.

Given the state of the economy for skating rinks, I doubt any rink would actively go out of its way to turn away possible customers.

I find it amusing about the "no black toe stops" thing. Every rink in the world has tons of rubbed off toe stop/wheel "debris" of all colors stuck to their floor (I've had to scrape some blue gunk off of my pads).

It's not terribly uncommon for certain venues that roller derby leagues use to freak out about the use of black plastic knee pads. At least one derby skate shop sells white plastic recaps for this reason. Somehow the owners/managers that freak out about whatever black plastic might leave behind seem to think that white is OK.

You wonder if it's some kind of thing where skaters who fall on the stuff and get it on their pants think it's grease and want to ask for the rink to "fix this" or something else? Some mental idea that black anything is more permanent (ala permanent markers vs those colored markers you used in elementary school).
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Old December 26th, 2009, 02:35 PM   #6
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Default One in KY

Some of our members down around Murray KY live with that restriction...

It's one rink I will never go to...
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Old December 29th, 2009, 08:29 AM   #7
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On the black/white thing - I always figured it was the same reasoning as "white-soled shoes only" on indoor sports courts. Although they tend to say 'non-marking soles' now ... lotta black or other-coloured soles on sneakers these days.
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Old December 29th, 2009, 02:52 PM   #8
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Every rink in the world has tons of rubbed off toe stop/wheel "debris" of all colors stuck to their floor (I've had to scrape some blue gunk off of my pads)
Not every.

There are only black marks on both of the rinks I frequent here...and every one of those have come from the back brakes on inlines. I've never seen a "normal" black toe stop leave a mark on either of those floors. I don't know if it's the wood itself, the polish they use or what. Both of the rinks here that I skate at were built (and are still currently maintained) by the same couple and their family so it's all the same (wood, polish, general maintenence).

Thankfully the rinks here don't care about stops/plugs (I still use 'em, though).
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Old December 29th, 2009, 04:54 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poobah View Post
It's a reasonably safe bet that that story involved an employee doing his or her best to enforce the letter of their boss' rule, and not the spirit. It's fairly probable that the employee didn't know WHY toe stops or plugs were required, just that they were.
I got that. My home rink hired a skate guard for adult night. He comes from ice hockey. He can skate and has some knowledge about quad skates, but not much.

One night he comes over and tells me I need to put in toe stops. I say it is impossible. My skates do not have a place for stops. He then proceeds to tell me to remove my skates, I proceed to tell him to get the manager. The manager then educates him about NTS plates. He got a lesson about quads and I got an apology. I have to give the kid credit, he did exactly what the boss told him to do, even through the boss didn't give him all the information he really needed.
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Old December 30th, 2009, 02:43 AM   #10
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Hate to add to the rink legends, but I also know a guy on the road who was turned away due to having a NTS plate. Discouraging to hear. I have a NTS plate myself.

When I spot someone looking to buy a NTS plate on the forums I try to warn them about this. It does happen once in a blue moon. Certainly I've been checked on a stopped plate at rinks before on multiple occasions. Sometimes, if your dance plugs are sanded too flat, they can still withhold entry. That's why I try to keep a mint pair of stoppers if necessary. An alternative is a stopped plate that has a higher slope on the stop housing. So if you skated without plugs it might behave closer to an NTS. The Sunlite is an example. Since it's mostly plastic, the owner may let it pass if you don't have plugs...

I also believe this rule is due to ownership being uninformed about the different skates and skaters out there. Looking at it from the owner's perspective, it is a costly gamble to have a different skate setup possibly gouge your floor. Though I've never seen it, I'd gander that on a longer NTS plate (or where the boot toe is worn) poorly mounted, there's the possibility of the toe bending up just enough to expose the tip of the metal plate. It's a stretch to imagine this though...

Last edited by diagetus; March 21st, 2010 at 07:52 AM. Reason: added plate suggestion
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Old December 30th, 2009, 08:09 AM   #11
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You havent seen too many of the plates Aussi Scott has mounted over the years.

I have seen plenty of NTS plates (not giottos but propper NTS plates) which can touch the floor even without the boot being deformend or worn.

At the rink I skated at as a teenager the rink used to inspect skates upon entry to check for this. If they found a offending skate (or one with stopper mounts and no stoppers) they just used to take them over to the skate hire booth where there was a vise and ............... chuck the skate in the vise and hack saw off the front.............they usually sawed into the sole of the boot and took off two mounting bolts in the process. They charged $5 for this service.
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Old December 30th, 2009, 03:19 PM   #12
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dude we would ask them to buy plugs or get the wrap around toe guard we sold for like 3 bucks. and if they refused that then we told then they would have to wear rentals.
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Old January 6th, 2010, 07:05 AM   #13
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I perhaps am missing the point of this. This rule would seem to be there to protect an expensive floor. I am not sure about colors but a scratch in a floor is very destructive. Correct me if I am wrong about this as I have limited quad experience.
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Old January 6th, 2010, 08:12 AM   #14
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motosk8ter - I perhaps am missing the point of this. This rule would seem to be there to protect an expensive floor. I am not sure about colors but a scratch in a floor is very destructive. Correct me if I am wrong about this as I have limited quad experience.
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Yep. That's the main reason. However, the frustration on the skater's end is that this doesn't always result in a damaged floor as a result of skating with the NTS setup. In fact, it's the plates made to hold a stopper that are the main danger when there is not a stopper present. In that case, the metal is actually quite close to the floor. If figure mounted, it's very hard to get the metal to touch the ground on the NTS. It's only when it's mounted far to the front (or the toe is extremely flexible) that this is even remotely possible. Figure skaters use NTS plates because they don't have to do the toe assisted jumps like the Freestylers. So the NTS plate, arguably the first design, isn't a new concept. A rink owner/manager should be familiar with that. Unfortunately, it doesn't always work out that way...
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Old January 6th, 2010, 12:04 PM   #15
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The rink where I skate requires toe plugs or toe stops but they rarely check to make sure people have them. Seems as if they're only interested in making a sale. Each time they recoat their floor they check everyone coming into the rink to see if they have one or the other. If not you'll have to buy it from them. Then they don't check anymore until the next time they recoat the floor.

I use toe plugs but I don't do a lotta jam skating...mostly what is called shuffle skating.
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Old January 7th, 2010, 08:25 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by motosk8ter View Post
I perhaps am missing the point of this. This rule would seem to be there to protect an expensive floor.
One rink I used to skate went on a toe stop kick for a few weeks. You had to have stops, plugs and NTS were unacceptable for that brief period of time.

The manager's thinking was that toes stops will stop you on a dime so you can avoid a crash or fall. He thought that if you didn't have toe stops, you couldn't stop. Luckily that policy was changed in short order by the owner.
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Old January 8th, 2010, 02:48 AM   #17
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Hi Kennedy,

Yet another Manager who knew too little about skating and skate equipment - so lots of folks got to suffer. Must not have been a Skater, or at least much of one. Just what any Rink needs more of. NOT !!

Harold
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Old January 9th, 2010, 12:08 AM   #18
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Unhappy High Skatervideoguy

"Yet another Manager who knew too little about skating and skate equipment - so lots of folks got to suffer. Must not have been a Skater, or at least much of one. Just what any Rink needs more of. NOT !!"


Why is it that skating rinks seem so often to be purchased or managed by people that either are not skaters or not good skaters. Usually these types of owners/managers manage to drive their rink out of business.

Dennis Lauer
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Old January 9th, 2010, 12:50 AM   #19
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Hi Dennis,

Perhaps there are just too many egotistic fools out there wanting to make an easy $$$. Seldom works.

Many of the folks I've talked to, claim they wanted their own business, and that they liked children. They thought they could do both in a Rink. (Whether, or not, they were skaters themselves)

Great and noble ideas, if you're willing to really learn about what you're going to do - most have managed not to do that so well. So everyone suffers from the lack of effective Rink Management, and a rather limited range of skating actiity and skills acquisition.

Think of the Rinks that do not allow "backward" skating, "spinning and footwork" in the center, and are running the Lighting too low, the Sound too loud, and music with bad messages and lack of a skating beat. This is usually done out of sheer ignorance or stupidity.

I can fix the ignorance (for those willing to learn), the stupidity is usually terminal.

Harold
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Last edited by Skatervideoguy; January 9th, 2010 at 03:26 PM.
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Old January 9th, 2010, 02:48 AM   #20
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I guess we need to hope that a new breed of rink owner/manager comes along.

Until we see people who are very knowledgeable about skating or very willing to learn about skating in ownership or management positions I am afraid we will continue to see the continued downward slide of roller skating.

Dennis Lauer
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